[Gen-art] Re: draft-ietf-quic-reliable-stream-reset-09 ietf last call Genart review
Christer Holmberg <christer.holmberg@ericsson.com> Wed, 05 August 2026 09:31 UTC
Return-Path: <christer.holmberg@ericsson.com>
X-Original-To: gen-art@mail2.ietf.org
Delivered-To: gen-art@mail2.ietf.org
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail2.ietf.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A34FF123F82E1; Wed, 5 Aug 2026 02:31:34 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=ietf.org; s=ietf1; t=1785922294; bh=+Ny0uRC539lxSCZW856jQX/TGcu9zoYNmL48CUDp/8g=; h=From:To:CC:Subject:Date:References:In-Reply-To; b=d6JwJs0jtUvzCjSYjU0hVpzLmThpSn8MonPvnlQeb/IDgGpoUDlcG2tPYq9hekJnR aJfk5inBzvoqg5BmwFeLrRnWxI5SCLUJdk6xU6ASaof9akGlTYnZXAWMvS+mPq80W/ fmss4iWCpJYRLCclVOYBWc/1Dusltnzy71QOUKbk=
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at ietf.org
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.096
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.096 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=0.001, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_CERTIFIED_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_RPBL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: mail2.ietf.org (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=ericsson.com
Received: from mail2.ietf.org ([166.84.6.31]) by localhost (mail2.ietf.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id t6l3sn3GjQm2; Wed, 5 Aug 2026 02:31:34 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from GVXPR05CU001.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-swedencentralazon11013001.outbound.protection.outlook.com [52.101.83.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-384) server-signature ECDSA (P-256) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by mail2.ietf.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D3501123F82DC; Wed, 5 Aug 2026 02:31:33 -0700 (PDT)
ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector10001; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=Shryvdzc0RTNh17/vritt5c8EY6rN65kZMBVuX6HgodBB0F6utOeQvqpVTKjqlP7JlLhSqaLfftcn5kBTkDlpJ5Tg6Oe6BbbgJa57rKgai/xQg1pxYg7DBcT/B2hJKykyHc8PFKV8YJYuIMHXUYrw+8IEgedA9C/e7yQELicRFoMhvMNl/r+UFHnoiiXMrBt2P9t+gAn1TxsApEzPZb1rRKLFA3fAiCLT7au2puNeIiBFRBFD6HwpanEGRfaY5ksyCR2hWhQVQPCot8QYQ/ZzTcJhLLNw9Ala2k8VhvMn/JX4ld185noKi4tc8gcFv0CiSzfw6ohUE3sZL1akG/pbQ==
ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector10001; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-ChunkCount:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-0:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-1; bh=+Ny0uRC539lxSCZW856jQX/TGcu9zoYNmL48CUDp/8g=; b=St7YTcuKUItp5C69JFf0RdmdSiEek9HUVRxTi4xEKNV4+KLO4PPZT0N2wH1RL/vt/QXYVsO+GSk+wzb6kp6HwhYA4INSKR9DwJUUs8cgVmYZLfFMwcHgflpDB+dasydeOZKD0N7MbBaz99bCYqtRPIVhuTY1nzlCzjCIi1q9Z58wEGHYroIaXH9tCsEr5uNIqFNAFV8sUTXz17XEl2WXnUFbo2jGmdaXv4Nmq2BDOooaEJweA0ejPeboSWHG1RsfqIK6wktYL0LZDNL42K7BrZbapEHYae/1jKRCXxSnwaKKkDajF3l+S/tHTuHj6GLTKKOvr8HFRkNbjkcefMH1/g==
ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=ericsson.com; dmarc=pass action=none header.from=ericsson.com; dkim=pass header.d=ericsson.com; arc=none
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ericsson.com; s=selector2; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=+Ny0uRC539lxSCZW856jQX/TGcu9zoYNmL48CUDp/8g=; b=FyPWYk+AbOg0hieI3+UJ67Xrw6GeEEMJqcMp8/e7bBPc+RjiiOmANle3vxSpcKj4lCDIeDHfQZZ/VS7JYdqvizjKVsfmJmgZXTX/73o3Vj+IgwLvscC0CKpRLciw1fbiN7qx9Q1rFgMlG2HGf3Rp1MHHyWhJYux4uplJQ5LXthoruACI3OLYpaMBo1mmCiWVPC5yZgibu4U9TnaUml0dYNqYz1kfDd6Yqj8ttNoXnoFQuEZHX6fL8cAJVLkjRJ0S0+a62l6F63+K+ShZzUBZdzXssFNONOpq8JjqshH+Azi9PCOSdY+KSdyT3p6kmX0bfW1l92gnWOM8wQcQy6HcrQ==
Received: from AS8PR07MB8069.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com (2603:10a6:20b:358::7) by VI1PR07MB6351.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com (2603:10a6:800:142::24) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.21.292.19; Wed, 5 Aug 2026 09:31:24 +0000
Received: from AS8PR07MB8069.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::9bd2:f3ca:f5e2:af88]) by AS8PR07MB8069.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::9bd2:f3ca:f5e2:af88%6]) with mapi id 15.21.0315.001; Wed, 5 Aug 2026 09:31:18 +0000
From: Christer Holmberg <christer.holmberg@ericsson.com>
To: Marten Seemann <martenseemann@gmail.com>, Christian Huitema <huitema@huitema.net>
Thread-Topic: draft-ietf-quic-reliable-stream-reset-09 ietf last call Genart review
Thread-Index: AQHdI226StwIMEdowUOAwb3EkscOnraNbyuAgAGjyqA=
Date: Wed, 05 Aug 2026 09:31:17 +0000
Message-ID: <AS8PR07MB80699E400894A0F8400FAC2093D32@AS8PR07MB8069.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com>
References: <178576073151.1915479.14385230021826342697@dt-datatracker-d4d6ff9d9-fsx7d> <52159ff3-901d-40d0-8949-dd1aea1161ed@huitema.net> <CAOYVs2oPSDHe8bp-2oPJyhYBDOpmZ7hsw-3x4M9vcALgdxVX1A@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CAOYVs2oPSDHe8bp-2oPJyhYBDOpmZ7hsw-3x4M9vcALgdxVX1A@mail.gmail.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
authentication-results: dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;dmarc=none action=none header.from=ericsson.com;
x-ms-publictraffictype: Email
x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: AS8PR07MB8069:EE_|VI1PR07MB6351:EE_
x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 9590dbec-5b7e-4111-6d2c-08def2d44d82
x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1
x-ms-exchange-antispam-relay: 0
x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0;ARA:13230040|376014|23010399003|366016|1800799024|38070700021|6133799003|10067099003|11063799006|5023799004|56012099006|4143699003|18002099003|22082099003|3023799007|4133799003;
x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: 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
x-forefront-antispam-report: CIP:255.255.255.255;CTRY:;LANG:en;SCL:1;SRV:;IPV:NLI;SFV:NSPM;H:AS8PR07MB8069.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com;PTR:;CAT:NONE;SFS:(13230040)(376014)(23010399003)(366016)(1800799024)(38070700021)(6133799003)(10067099003)(11063799006)(5023799004)(56012099006)(4143699003)(18002099003)(22082099003)(3023799007)(4133799003);DIR:OUT;SFP:1101;
x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-chunkcount: 1
x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-0: 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
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-OriginatorOrg: ericsson.com
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: AS8PR07MB8069.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 9590dbec-5b7e-4111-6d2c-08def2d44d82
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 05 Aug 2026 09:31:18.0292 (UTC)
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 92e84ceb-fbfd-47ab-be52-080c6b87953f
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: OscNEyK5TQJm5Esn+0WCEwXMWl3SI+leDvmtAEeJMnSaROOzETk4lq32fM/ERdtGsZLkMgRNwOUzaS/Xucw21fyVRtGzNzCkaV/1YFwZvGI=
X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: VI1PR07MB6351
Message-ID-Hash: LXNZJF33WEIZ3XTCMJNX7TILMEFQ3C2H
X-Message-ID-Hash: LXNZJF33WEIZ3XTCMJNX7TILMEFQ3C2H
X-MailFrom: christer.holmberg@ericsson.com
X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-gen-art.ietf.org-0; header-match-gen-art.ietf.org-1; header-match-gen-art.ietf.org-2; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header
CC: "gen-art@ietf.org" <gen-art@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-quic-reliable-stream-reset.all@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-quic-reliable-stream-reset.all@ietf.org>, "last-call@ietf.org" <last-call@ietf.org>, "quic@ietf.org" <quic@ietf.org>
X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.9rc6
Precedence: list
Subject: [Gen-art] Re: draft-ietf-quic-reliable-stream-reset-09 ietf last call Genart review
List-Id: "GEN-ART: General Area Review Team" <gen-art.ietf.org>
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/gen-art/2rPUZDNgqlrlAA1VSCM4ftdBXk8>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/gen-art>
List-Help: <mailto:gen-art-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Owner: <mailto:gen-art-owner@ietf.org>
List-Post: <mailto:gen-art@ietf.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:gen-art-join@ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:gen-art-leave@ietf.org>
Hi Marten, Thanks for your reply. Please see inline. I have removed the issues where I am ok with the way they have been addressed and have no further comments. --- >> "When using a RESET_STREAM_AT frame, the initiator MUST guarantee >> reliable delivery of stream data of at least Reliable Size bytes. If STREAM >> frames containing data up to that byte offset are lost, the initiator MUST >> retransmit this data, as described in Section 13.3 of [RFC9000]. Data sent >> beyond that byte offset SHOULD NOT be retransmitted." > > This is unchanged from RFC 9000: Retransmitting data after RESET_STREAM is > not forbidden, it's just pointless and wasteful. I was thinking that there would be no data sent to begin with (with or without retransmission), as the sender using RESET_STREAM_AT has explicitly stated how much it will send reliably. But, as the sender is allowed to send data even after that, I am ok with the "SHOULD NOT be transmitted". --- >> Q: Is there a reason why RESET_STREAM_AT with Reliable Size = 0 could >> not be sent? It would be explicit, and match the peer's indication that it does not >> intend to process any further data. >> > RESET_STREAM_AT with Reliable Size = 0 is equivalent to RESET_STREAM, as > explained in section 5. Nothing stops you from sending a RESET_STREAM_AT, > you're just using more bytes on the wire to encode the same thing. Agree. I was just wondering about the strong preference (SHOULD) for RESET_STREAM over RESET_STREAM_AT in Section 5.4. --- > > Q: Please add a reference to RFC 9001 for 0-RTT. > > The requirement to remember transport parameters comes from section 7.4.1 > of RFC 9000. RFC 9000 mentions 0-RTT 85 (!) times. I don't think referencing > RFC 9001 provides much value, especially since we're not changing the QUIC > derivation paths. My comment is not related specifically to transport parameters, but more general to have a reference for 0-RTT. But, if the community thinks a reference is not needed I will not argue against it. --- >> Q: It sounds a little confusing to "remember an empty value". Perhaps >> saying that both endpoints must remember the presence of the transport parameter >> with the empty value, or something like that? > > https://github.com/quicwg/reliable-stream-reset/pull/91 > <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgith > ub.com%2Fquicwg%2Freliable-stream- > reset%2Fpull%2F91&data=05%7C02%7Cchrister.holmberg%40ericsson.com > %7C880bdb21f9b0401e9bb208def1f22da2%7C92e84cebfbfd47abbe52080 > c6b87953f%7C0%7C0%7C639214219615026144%7CUnknown%7CTWFpb > GZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4z > MiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=w1qAVd > ZQy%2BcpOFAGJLtL9cMTca8bCjXVzcsOK3HuUQA%3D&reserved=0> Looks good! :) Thanks! Regards, Christer
- [Gen-art] draft-ietf-quic-reliable-stream-reset-0… Christer Holmberg via Datatracker
- [Gen-art] Re: draft-ietf-quic-reliable-stream-res… Christian Huitema
- [Gen-art] Re: draft-ietf-quic-reliable-stream-res… Marten Seemann
- [Gen-art] Re: draft-ietf-quic-reliable-stream-res… Christer Holmberg
- [Gen-art] Re: draft-ietf-quic-reliable-stream-res… Christer Holmberg