Re: [GROW] I-D Action: draft-ietf-grow-as-path-prepending-09.txt

In looking at RFC 7454, I would argue that this document updates RFC 7454
by expanding and providing detail to the recommendation "to discourage
excessive pretending in such paths" in the first bullet of Section 9, AS
Path Filtering.

I don't think this document updates RFC 8195, but I think the reference to
RFC 8195 should remain in the introduction and be revised slightly;

Old; "AS Path Prepending is discussed in Use of BGP Large Communities
[RFC8195]."

New; "[RFC8195] discusses using BGP Large Communities for traffic
engineering through selective AS_PATH prepending."

Also, by the way, I prefer David Farmer to Dave Farmer in the
acknowledgment section.

Thanks

On Tue, Feb 6, 2024 at 2:43 PM Michael McBride <
michael.mcbride@futurewei.com> wrote:

> Sounds good, I’ll remove the updates and submit a new version tonight.
>
>
>
> mike
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Job Snijders <job@fastly.com>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 6, 2024 12:38 PM
> *To:* Michael McBride <michael.mcbride@futurewei.com>
> *Cc:* grow@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [GROW] I-D Action:
> draft-ietf-grow-as-path-prepending-09.txt
>
>
>
> Dear Michael,
>
>
>
> Perhaps a question was taken as a suggestion, but the draft doesn’t
> describe how it updates either RFC.
>
>
>
> Removing the updates section indeed is an option!
>
>
>
> Kind regards,
>
>
>
> Job
>
>
>
> On Tue, 6 Feb 2024 at 21:09, Michael McBride <
> michael.mcbride@futurewei.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Job,
>
> That is based on a list comment from a few years ago:
>
> "Re: [GROW] I-D Action: draft-ietf-grow-as-path-prepending-03.txt
> Michael McBride <michael.mcbride@futurewei.com> Fri, 19 March 2021 03:36
> UTCShow header
>
> >Is this going to update BCP194/RFC7454? I don't see any reference in the
> draft.
>
> We probably should. Good suggestion. I was thinking updating 8195 but 7454
> appears more appropriate.
>
> We will update the draft, based upon comments from last week, and add 7454
> unless we hear otherwise."
>
>
> We didn't hear otherwise. We can remove the updates section if it doesn't
> make sense.
>
> Thanks,
> mike
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Job Snijders <job@fastly.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, February 6, 2024 11:13 AM
> To: Michael McBride <michael.mcbride@futurewei.com>
> Cc: grow@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [GROW] I-D Action: draft-ietf-grow-as-path-prepending-09.txt
>
> Dear Michael,
>
> Before we proceed, can you clarify how exactly
> draft-ietf-grow-as-path-prepending updates RFC 7454 and RFC 8195?
>
> In relationship to 8195, the only sentence I see is "AS Path Prepending is
> discussed in Use of BGP Large Communities [RFC8195]." - which is true
> (8915 contains an example about prepending once), however the rest of the
> text in draft-ietf-grow-as-path-prepending-10 doesn't seem an 'update' in
> IETF document logistics parlance?
>
> Kind regards,
>
> Job
>
> On Tue, Feb 06, 2024 at 06:23:13PM +0000, Michael McBride wrote:
> > Hello grow chairs,
> >
> > Any chance we can get a wglc started on this draft after this latest
> > round of edits? The authors have felt it's ready for quite some time.
> > It's going on four years now. Please consider.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > mike
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: GROW <grow-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Michael McBride
> > Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2024 11:21 PM
> > To: Martin Pels <mpels@ripe.net>; grow@ietf.org
> > Subject: Re: [GROW] I-D Action:
> > draft-ietf-grow-as-path-prepending-09.txt
> >
> > Hi Martin,
> >
> > I just submitted a new version to address your (and Alejandro's)
> comments. See my comments in line (MM):
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: GROW <grow-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Martin Pels
> > Sent: Tuesday, January 9, 2024 1:00 AM
> > To: grow@ietf.org
> > Subject: Re: [GROW] I-D Action:
> > draft-ietf-grow-as-path-prepending-09.txt
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > Some comments
> > -------------
> >
> > Section 3.1 and 4:
> > As has been mentioned before on this list, I think using the term "route
> leak" in this scenario is confusing. Something like "suboptimal" or
> "unintended" routing would be a better fit.
> >
> > MM: Done. Used both terms in place of route leak.
> >
> > 3.2 and 3.3:
> > These do not appear to be separate problems, but rather two examples of
> the same problem (a malicious, shorter route being preferred over a
> legitimate, prepended route).
> >
> > MM: I think it is ok to describe two similar problems.
> >
> > 7:
> > This only mentions the sending side. There is also security advice to be
> given to the accepting side (see section 3.5 and 3.6). Something like
> "Accepting routes with extremely long AS_PATHs may cause increased memory
> usage and possibly router crashes."
> >
> > MM: I inserted exactly that sentence.
> >
> > A reference to ASPA may also be useful in this section, since this could
> help mitigate the effects of the route leaks described in 3.2 and 3.3.
> >
> > MM: Good idea, I added a sentence on ASPA.
> >
> > Text nits
> > ---------
> >
> > Abstract:
> > AS_Path attribute -> AS_PATH attribute
> >
> > MM: Done
> >
> > multiple entries of an AS -> multiple entries of an ASN
> >
> > MM: Done
> >
> > This document provides guidance with -> This document provides
> > guidance for
> >
> > MM: Done
> >
> > 1:
> > the AS_PATH attribute which -> the AS_PATH attribute, which
> >
> > MM: Done
> >
> > 2:
> > today including -> today, including
> >
> > MM: Done
> >
> > 4:
> > more then 1 -> more than 1
> >
> > MM: Done
> >
> > Thank you! I also added you and Alejandro to the acknowledgements.
> > Mike
> >
> >
> >
> > Kind regards,
> > Martin
> >
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