Re: [homenet] New version draft-mglt-homenet-naming-architecture-dhc-options-02.txt

Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com> Tue, 15 July 2014 20:53 UTC

Return-Path: <mellon@fugue.com>
X-Original-To: homenet@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: homenet@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3BCBC1A00B5 for <homenet@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 15 Jul 2014 13:53:44 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.552
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.552 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.651, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rSIzmpnsvAbC for <homenet@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 15 Jul 2014 13:53:42 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from toccata.fugue.com (toccata.fugue.com [204.152.186.142]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73FBB1B2911 for <homenet@ietf.org>; Tue, 15 Jul 2014 13:53:42 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [10.0.10.40] (c-71-233-43-215.hsd1.nh.comcast.net [71.233.43.215]) by toccata.fugue.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 7307A238088A; Tue, 15 Jul 2014 16:53:41 -0400 (EDT)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 7.3 \(1878.6\))
From: Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com>
In-Reply-To: <53C58EC7.7020905@mtcc.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2014 16:53:39 -0400
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message-Id: <ABAC9C0C-307C-42FC-A680-25B6E7F80AB8@fugue.com>
References: <CADZyTkk6rUuFJ5Wds2hioBBQa9-kXDJxyg_gBGQ1R6u5CHF2Ww@mail.gmail.com> <CADZyTk=YgD=JtyDpEz8TXOQmHxKzBoiEZbbW0LhZQy2GaKLqZQ@mail.gmail.com> <87vbrcydr9.wl.jch@pps.univ-paris-diderot.fr> <CADZyTk=kST4zPaPzz4DsAcCOtmYbQo-s2du+nEvJv0MSrneEMg@mail.gmail.com> <CADZyTkmZ+rC99qeC7gFEwc4JBoX9sHBUpo7p89+VC6zY7Z8drQ@mail.gmail.com> <87d2dfb98w.wl-jch@pps.univ-paris-diderot.fr> <CADZyTk=U25=Yck8BL5nrzGAR7mPk5HWp0r0h2wYy5ruSOf6rsQ@mail.gmail.com> <87vbr6mv8t.wl-jch@pps.univ-paris-diderot.fr> <7EEF5CD0-C3B8-4559-A75D-E55931F94F61@iki.fi> <21162.1405438875@sandelman.ca> <7ioawqpqcv.wl%jch@pps.univ-paris-diderot.fr> <7B5390DD-6969-4E26-A85E-0B436F48448F@fugue.com> <87a98acvxe.wl-jch@pps.univ-paris-diderot.fr> <E01C736F-75C0-436C-A283-28763208E46E@iki.fi> <F689B456-2A87-41BE-8884-ED23BD35D748@fugue.com> <53C58350.3020006@mt cc.com> <9F076247-1C4B-4006-98D7-BA1DAE2E9438@fugue.com> <53C58719.8020209@mtcc.com> <5EEF0BDB-839A-4E97-876B-C5F66153834C@fugue.com> <53C58EC7.7020905@mtcc.com >
To: Michael Thomas <mike@mtcc.com>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1878.6)
Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/homenet/lJmhTRiTJ9dWFxELLY8vszDEweo
Cc: homenet@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [homenet] New version draft-mglt-homenet-naming-architecture-dhc-options-02.txt
X-BeenThere: homenet@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: <homenet.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/homenet>, <mailto:homenet-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/homenet/>
List-Post: <mailto:homenet@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:homenet-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/homenet>, <mailto:homenet-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2014 20:53:44 -0000

On Jul 15, 2014, at 4:27 PM, Michael Thomas <mike@mtcc.com>; wrote:
> Good. If that can be done at all, is there a reason that it cannot have those properties?
> That is if, say, my Google Nest spams my local homenet advertising the Google Eggs-in-one-basket
> DNS service, it should use the same set of protocols as a local ISP advertising over DHCP to
> actually hook everything up between my CPE and their service.

We can safely assume that any device that is monetized through the cloud will do everything in its power to prevent us from accessing it, so that's really not the interesting test case.   The interesting test case is whether a Nest-like device that isn't operated through the manufacturer's captive portal will use this set of standard protocols.   (I don't know what the policies behind Nest are specifically, but the phenomenon I'm talking about is more the rule than the exception in citizen-grade IoT devices at the moment).

> Can we make this a *requirement*? If not, why not?

We can't force anybody to do anything, that's why not.   But we can document a mechanism for doing it, and if implementation becomes widespread in home gateways, it's not unreasonable to think that devices that _don't_ depend on a captive portal for monetization will use these protocols rather than reinventing the wheel.   But bear in mind that this is a fairly big "if."