Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS
Julian Reschke <julian.reschke@gmx.de> Mon, 10 March 2014 10:22 UTC
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Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2014 11:19:15 +0100
From: Julian Reschke <julian.reschke@gmx.de>
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To: "henry.story@bblfish.net" <henry.story@bblfish.net>, Martin Thomson <martin.thomson@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS
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On 2014-03-10 10:16, henry.story@bblfish.net wrote: > > On 9 Mar 2014, at 08:37, Martin Thomson <martin.thomson@gmail.com> wrote: > >> On 8 March 2014 11:39, Martin Thomson <martin.thomson@gmail.com> wrote: >>> Pursuant to our discussion on TLS renegotiation, I've submitted part 1 >>> of the solution I proposed as an internet draft. >>> >>> http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-thomson-tls-care/ >>> >>> If we agree to a mechanism whereby we augment the 401 status code with >>> a "go away and make a new TLS connection with client authentication", >>> then this is necessary, so that the server knows to request a client >>> certificate. >> >> Now with part 2: >> >> http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-thomson-httpbis-catch/ > > I really like both of these. I allready responded on the TLS mailing list > about draft-thomson-tls-care [1]. For draft-thomson-httbis-catch I would > like to suggest an improvement that would be essential for "self-signed" > or rather "unknown server signed" certificates, i.e., certificates signed > by some server that is not a CA. This allows for much more widespread > creation of client certificates, since they don't anymore need to be > verified by a few CAs, but instead allows the deployment of a web of > trust - a linked data web of trust to be precise. This allows one client > side certificate to be used to sign on to any web site. > > A WebID is just an http(s) URL that refers to an Agent ( human, robot, > organisation, ...) We have defined it in the spec "WebID 1.0" [2]. One > can then place a WebID in the Subject Alternative Name (SAN) field of an X509 > certificate as shown in WebID Authentication over TLS [3] ( or even in the > Issuer Alternative Name field (IAN)). The last spec relies on TLS as it is > currently, but would be redundant if draft-thomson-httpbis-catch went through. > (Until wide deployment of TLS1.3 which I suppose may take some time). > > Now I am not absolutely sure where this improvement I want to suggest, > needs to be added: at the HTTP layer, or at the TLS layer. Currently TLS > allows a server to specify using the certificate_authorities list what > the list of Certificate Authorities the server accepts, so that the client > does not send Certificates that are not signed by one that is known to the server, > and which the server would then have to refuse. > But with WebID Authentication we don't need a CA, so it would be nice to be > able to specify that the server knows how to do WebID verification, ie part > 5 and 6 of > http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/webid/spec/tls/#authentication-sequence > bB > If in TLS the server sends the empty certificate_authorities list. But that > is too wide, since that means the client can send ANY Certificate. The > server may not know what to do with most of them ( other than perhaps > identify the user indirectly by the public key, but that is only minimally > interesting - it does not allow one to build a web of trust ). > > My guess is that since this could evolve faster than the TLS layer, it may > be better if this were done in the HTTP header. So perhaps a header like > > WWW-Authenticate: ClientCertificate,SAN=WebID > > would do. One could also imagine a > > WWW-Authenticate: ClientCertificate,IAN=WebID > ... Note: it would be WWW-Authenticate: ClientCertificate IAN=WebID (see grammar in <http://greenbytes.de/tech/webdav/draft-ietf-httpbis-p7-auth-26.html#access.authentication.framework>) Best regards, Julian
- FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Martin Thomson
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Ilari Liusvaara
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Martin Thomson
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Ilari Liusvaara
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Martin Thomson
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS henry.story@bblfish.net
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Ilari Liusvaara
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Martin Thomson
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Martin Thomson
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Julian Reschke
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Martin Thomson
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Julian Reschke
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Martin Thomson
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Julian Reschke
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Yoav Nir
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Julian Reschke
- Feedback on draft-thomson-httpbis-catch Julian Reschke
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Yoav Nir
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Julian Reschke
- Re: Feedback on draft-thomson-httpbis-catch Martin Thomson
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Martin Thomson
- Re: Feedback on draft-thomson-httpbis-catch Julian Reschke
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Yoav Nir
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Yoav Nir
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Martin Thomson
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Michael Köller
- Re: FYI: proposal for client authentication in TLS Martin Thomson