Re: [hybi] Fwd: The MessageBroker WebSocket Subprotocol

Greg Wilkins <gregw@intalio.com> Mon, 03 October 2011 00:42 UTC

Return-Path: <gregw@intalio.com>
X-Original-To: hybi@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: hybi@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E21DB21F849B for <hybi@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 2 Oct 2011 17:42:38 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.918
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.918 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.059, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rcQKqnOZcyFB for <hybi@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 2 Oct 2011 17:42:38 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-vw0-f44.google.com (mail-vw0-f44.google.com [209.85.212.44]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52EE821F8498 for <hybi@ietf.org>; Sun, 2 Oct 2011 17:42:38 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by vws5 with SMTP id 5so3820126vws.31 for <hybi@ietf.org>; Sun, 02 Oct 2011 17:45:37 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Received: by 10.52.97.193 with SMTP id ec1mr13611302vdb.69.1317602737629; Sun, 02 Oct 2011 17:45:37 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.52.186.134 with HTTP; Sun, 2 Oct 2011 17:45:37 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <4E88AB8D.6050407@callenish.com>
References: <92457F4F764A5C4785FCDBDDDD76477A123C1C1A@dfweml506-mbx> <4E88236E.4040405@ericsson.com> <CABLsOLADfORBHVfPax75sQeRXTmTav8aOMfey_+KuSO=oPLsEA@mail.gmail.com> <4E88AB8D.6050407@callenish.com>
Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2011 11:45:37 +1100
Message-ID: <CAH_y2NH0KRi_mdvOQScFJtdWmKfFCk-g7C7F3e-xTYwA5C2CSw@mail.gmail.com>
From: Greg Wilkins <gregw@intalio.com>
To: Bruce Atherton <bruce@callenish.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"
Cc: "hybi@ietf.org" <hybi@ietf.org>, Hapner mark <hapner.mark@huawei.com>
Subject: Re: [hybi] Fwd: The MessageBroker WebSocket Subprotocol
X-BeenThere: hybi@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: Server-Initiated HTTP <hybi.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/hybi>, <mailto:hybi-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/hybi>
List-Post: <mailto:hybi@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:hybi-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hybi>, <mailto:hybi-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2011 00:42:39 -0000

On 3 October 2011 05:21, Bruce Atherton <bruce@callenish.com> wrote:
> As I pointed out in my example with HTTP (which required Request and
> Response message types), it is going to be very common for subprotocols to
> want to define new opcodes. They are the right fit for defining message
> types in a subprotocol.

Bruce,

I do not think  opcodes are the right fit for defining messages in a
subprotocol (at least not in the ws protocol as we have designed it).

While I can imagine some subprotocols would desire to have opcode like
metadata associated with a message, I  can also imagine many
subprotocols will use JSON/XML as their message exchange format and
thus will better use fields/elements/attributes to convey message
type.

The way we have defined the protocol, opcodes are a constrained and
regulated resource that must be allocated by IANA. They may be used by
extensions, which themselves have a high barrier to deployment as they
need to be implemented in the browsers and servers, since the
application API is insufficient (and inappropriate) for implementing
extensions.

Subprotocols are exposed to the application in the browser API, so I
believe that sub protocol designs need to be restricted to what can be
achieved without API changes or IANA allocations.   I think this is a
good thing and keeps the barrier low for sub protocol development.

regards