Re: [Iasa20] Venue Selection Terminology - WG Input??

[Joseph Lorenzo Hall <[e-mail]>]

(I'll just note that I have a to-do to pull the 4071 appeals process into
-struct since that is now 4071bis. I'm unlikely to get to that until later
this week.)

On Mon, Nov 5, 2018 at 11:03 Livingood, Jason <[e-mail]>
wrote:

> See the thread below that hit the mailing list a short time ago. What do
> folks think here? Should the meeting venue WG proceed with this draft
> referring generally to the IASA or specifically to the IETF LLC?
>
> Thanks in advance for your input!
> Jason
>
> On 11/5/18, 11:01 AM, "Livingood, Jason" <
> [e-mail]> wrote:
>
>     Sorry for the delay! I just took a detailed look at the -16 version of
> the document at
> https://tools.ietf.org/pdf/draft-ietf-mtgvenue-iaoc-venue-selection-process-16.pdf
> and the diff in question at
> https://www.rfc-editor.org/authors/rfc8491-auth48diff.html.
>
>     My opinion is that the draft revision made on 9/12/2017 to change
> instances of the IAOC to IASA are probably sufficient, though we have
> tended to update other docs to refer to the IETF Administration LLC when it
> was IAOC previously. Yes, you could make it IETF LLC as the diff proposes,
> but just generalizing to IASA also appears to work. So either approach will
> work IMO -- IASA or IETF LLC.
>
>     As a side note, one thing the diff does is drops the reference to RFC
> 4071's general appeals process. The diff proposes dropping that and the
> associated normative reference to RFC 4071. This might be one thing worth
> doing in the draft because there does not seem like there's much need to
> specifically call out the appeals process per se, and that appeals process
> is specified in IASA-related or other IETF process-related documents.
>
>     But... this is just my opinion as a co-chair. Will ask others in the
> IASA2 WG for feedback now (new thread).
>
>     JL
>
>
>     On 10/26/18, 8:22 AM, "Alissa Cooper" <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>         Is there any update on this?
>
>         Thanks,
>         Alissa
>
>         > On Oct 19, 2018, at 11:51 PM, Livingood, Jason <
> [e-mail]> wrote:
>         >
>         > Thanks for this heads-up, Pete! We in the IASA2 WG will put this
> in our work queue. I will take a look as co-chair early next week and try
> to actively start up list discussion on the details.
>         >
>         > Jason
>         >
>         > On 10/19/18, 5:38 PM, "iasa20 on behalf of Pete Resnick" <
> [e-mail] on behalf of [e-mail]> wrote:
>         >
>         >    IASA 2.0 folks:
>         >
>         >    With my mtgvenue chair hat on: An issue has come up over in
> mtgvenue
>         >    that I think really needs to be resolved by iasa20, and in
> particular
>         >    not by the mtgvenue folks alone.
>         >
>         >    The Venue Selection document,
>         >    <
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-mtgvenue-iaoc-venue-selection-process/>,
>
>         >    refers to "IASA" throughout. When written, the document
> presumed that we
>         >    were working under IASA 1.0, and had references to RFC 4071.
> When our
>         >    documents got to AUTH48, we realized that it was going to
> come out right
>         >    on the heels of the IASA 2.0 docs and that it would be silly
> to publish
>         >    only to have to turn around and fix things. The initial
> suggestion in
>         >    mtgvenue was to pretty much do a global replace of "IASA"
> with "IETF
>         >    LLC" (with some other editorial changes). The document
> editor's version
>         >    with those edits is here:
>         >    <https://www.rfc-editor.org/authors/rfc8491-auth48diff.html>.
> However, a
>         >    few folks (and in particular, folks who are active in iasa20)
> noted that
>         >    in fact "IASA" was correct, because under IASA 2.0, the LLC
> is under
>         >    IASA, and that using "LLC" might be incorrect in some
> instances.
>         >    Conversely, some folks thought that "LLC" was a clearer
> reference. As
>         >    that discussion has evolved, your faithful mtgvenue chair is
> no longer
>         >    sure that we've gotten this exactly right. On top of that,
> Alissa has
>         >    indicated that it's probably better to have iasa20 figure out
> what
>         >    terminology is appropriate to refer to the assorted entities,
> for the
>         >    sake of all documents, not just mtgvenue's.
>         >
>         >    So, I would ask that the iasa20 WG review the above two
> documents and
>         >    let us know whether we've got it right or wrong, and
> generally let us
>         >    know which terminology should be used in which circumstances.
> I'm sure
>         >    mtgvenue folks will pipe up with their concerns, but guidance
> should
>         >    really be coming from a discussion in iasa20.
>         >
>         >    BTW: Don't worry about the fact that the document is in
> AUTH48 or
>         >    whether it will need a new Last Call or whatever. Let's get
> the document
>         >    correct first, and then we'll figure out what process knobs,
> lights, and
>         >    buttons need to be operated.
>         >
>         >    Cheers,
>         >
>         >    pr
>         >    --
>         >    Pete Resnick http://www.episteme.net/
>         >    All connections to the world are tenuous at best
>         >
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-- 
Joseph Lorenzo Hall
Chief Technologist, Center for Democracy & Technology [https://www.cdt.org]
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