Re: [iccrg] New Version Notification for draft-welzl-irtf-iccrg-tcp-in-udp-00.txt

Hi all,

My apologies, I made a mistake: first I said that this should be discussed here in ICCRG, then I answered a comment on a different list and we ended up having a congestion control related discussion there.
Just what I wanted to avoid - I’d really like to collect the discussion of this draft in this list.

This email is me trying to undo this mistake and set the context for continuing the discussion here. The dialogue happened on the IAB stackevo-discuss list, and you can find it in its archives here:
https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/search/?email_list=stackevo-discuss

To summarize:
- Tom Herbert suggested that, instead of UDP encapsulation, one could just use the IPv6 flow label. That seems very reasonable to me and unless someone debates that, we’ll incorporate this in the next version of the draft (for the v6 case).
- Joe Touch raised issues about the idea of such tunneling, and pointed to an INTAREA tunnels draft for an explanation of these issues. I got surprised by this  but I’m not an expert on tunneling, so I’ll read this and try to understand the problem there.
- Joe Touch had comments related to congestion control; his point of view is that the UDP header is unnecessary because you could couple congestion controls even when packets traverse different paths. Here I disagree. My next email will continue this discussion with him, here on ICCRG.

Cheers,
Michael

> On 23. mar. 2016, at 09.02, Michael Welzl <michawe@ifi.uio.no> wrote:
> 
> Chair hat on:
> 
> We just put a presentation of the draft below on the agenda:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/95/agenda/iccrg/
> ...which still has space. Note that the duration written next to presentation reflects the presenters' wishes, not our ultimate decision, so there may be more time available than it seems.
> 
> If you have something to present, this is the right time to tell us! Don't wait until the last minute please.
> 
> 
> 
> Chair hat off:
> 
> Dear all,
> 
> I'm submitting this to ICCRG as the primary (and possibly ultimate? We'll see) forum to discuss this draft. We'd be happy to get your comments - please keep them on the ICCRG list.
> We have FreeBSD code, from which we can already confirm that the encapsulation is indeed relatively easy to do (as our draft states). However, it doesn't do the congestion control coupling yet; we're working on it. For that, so far, we have simulations - from these, we hope to be able to show some first results in BA.
> 
> Cheers,
> Michael
> 
> 
> 
>> Begin forwarded message:
>> 
>> From: <internet-drafts@ietf.org>
>> Subject: New Version Notification for draft-welzl-irtf-iccrg-tcp-in-udp-00.txt
>> Date: 21 Mar 2016 18:45:57 CET
>> To: Jianjie You <youjianjie@huawei.com>, Michael Welzl <michawe@ifi.uio.no>, Safiqul Islam <safiquli@ifi.uio.no>, Kristian Hiorth <kristahi@ifi.uio.no>
>> Resent-From: <michawe@ifi.uio.no>
>> 
>> 
>> A new version of I-D, draft-welzl-irtf-iccrg-tcp-in-udp-00.txt
>> has been successfully submitted by Michael Welzl and posted to the
>> IETF repository.
>> 
>> Name:		draft-welzl-irtf-iccrg-tcp-in-udp
>> Revision:	00
>> Title:		TCP in UDP
>> Document date:	2016-03-21
>> Group:		Individual Submission
>> Pages:		17
>> URL:            https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-welzl-irtf-iccrg-tcp-in-udp-00.txt
>> Status:         https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-welzl-irtf-iccrg-tcp-in-udp/
>> Htmlized:       https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-welzl-irtf-iccrg-tcp-in-udp-00
>> 
>> 
>> Abstract:
>>  This document specifies a method to encapsulate multiple TCP
>>  connections using only one UDP port number pair.  Doing so allows for
>>  a relatively easy implementation of coupled congestion control for
>>  the TCP connections.  This can have several performance benefits, and
>>  it makes it possible to precisely assign a share of the congestion
>>  window to the connections based on priorities.  It also enables use
>>  of UDP-based NAT traversal techniques, and it can act as a framework
>>  for experimentation with novel changes to the TCP standard.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
>> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.
>> 
>> The IETF Secretariat
>> 
> 
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