Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-faltstrom-unicode11-05.txt> (IDNA2008 and Unicode 11.0.0) to Informational RFC
"Asmus Freytag (c)" <asmusf@ix.netcom.com> Fri, 07 December 2018 08:41 UTC
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To: John C Klensin <john-ietf@jck.com>, Larry Masinter <LMM@acm.org>, 'Patrik Fältström' <paf=40frobbit.se@dmarc.ietf.org>
Cc: i18nrp@ietf.org, 'Paul Hoffman' <paul.hoffman@vpnc.org>, idna-update@ietf.org
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From: "Asmus Freytag (c)" <asmusf@ix.netcom.com>
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Date: Fri, 07 Dec 2018 00:41:48 -0800
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Subject: Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-faltstrom-unicode11-05.txt> (IDNA2008 and Unicode 11.0.0) to Informational RFC
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On 12/6/2018 9:39 PM, John C Klensin wrote: > Part of the problem with the IDNA RFCs is that the requirement > for registry conservatism and responsibility is too scattered > through several documents to come across as important as I think > we all believe it is. draft-klensin-idna-rfc5891bis (now > expired, but waiting in the wings) was intended to address that > issue. I haven't looked at the text for a while but strongly > suspect it does not identify and stress labels being > "re-enterable" and "retypable" as you suggest. It should. If > you don't mind taking a look at it, I'd appreciate recommended > text. Or, if that isn't convenient, I'll try to remember to > say something when I next open the document. To "typable", you might add "processable" and "renderable", not to mention "human-readable". (Where multiple languages/scripts are supported, "typable" should obviously mean"typable by a native user of that language/script"). Allowing certain specialized or historical forms that are not part of the modern orthographic repertoire would allow characters that are unlikely to be supported by keyboards (or even fonts). (Some such characters are effectively not recognized by modern readers, or simply mistaken for more familiar characters). Allowing "do not use" sequences renders labels not processable by processes that do expect data to not contain effectively deprecated content. (They are also structurally unsound, see next). Allowing structurally unsound sequences for any of the fifteen or so complex scripts risks data not being renderable, as neither layout systems or fonts are (universally) expecting to deal with them (or do it differently in unpredictable ways). T Allowing arbitrary sequences can lead to strings that human readers are not prepared to recognize because they violate deep-seated assumption of what is possible. Linearly progressing, non-connecting scripts tend to not have that issue; ASCII certainly doesn't, but already with Latin combining marks you enter territory where fully random sequences can't be supported. Then you get into the issue of substitutable code points/labels that should not be simultaneously allowed (aka "blocked" variants) -- the other type of variants ("allocatable") is more of a usability issue, which for some scripts can be critical but is not strictly required under the heading of "Conservatism". Allowing two labels that even reasonably observant readers will substitute for one another, because different abstract text elements in Unicode may have identical (or very near identical) appearance when presented in typical user interfaces, adds no value, only security risks. (Yes this is a subset of the wider issue of labels that are merely similar, but that's not an excuse to take well-known an unambiguous cases off the table at the policy level). Spelling out these considerations would go beyond what is currently scattered through the IDNA RFCs, but would be a first step to putting the Registries on notice what their responsibility actually entails. Now that we have the Root Zone LGR giving practical examples (and the emerging reference LGRs doing the same for the second level), there's less excuse for registries not doing the right thing - good approximate solutions exist. A./
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… John C Klensin
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… John C Klensin
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… John C Klensin
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… Patrik Fältström
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… John C Klensin
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… Nico Williams
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… Vint Cerf
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… Nico Williams
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… John C Klensin
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… Asmus Freytag (c)
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… Asmus Freytag (c)
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… Asmus Freytag (c)
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… Nico Williams
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… Nico Williams
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… Shawn Steele
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… Larry Masinter
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… Martin J. Dürst
- Re: [Idna-update] [I18nrp] Last Call: <draft-falt… Martin J. Dürst