Re: Possible General Area MiniBOF 1: IESG structure and charter

[Brian E Carpenter <[e-mail]>]

Harald,

I believe (speaking personally) that the analysis described below
would take enormous effort and would probably take a couple of years.
And despite the description, it isn't really focussed on the IESG -
the IESG's role is actually defined more or less automatically
by all the surrounding entities, procedures, and external forces.

I think we need to take smaller bites. My ambition is much less, indeed.

Of course, anyone who thinks they can identify energetic
resources to tackle what you cite below is free to propose
a BOF (but it clearly can't be a mini-BOF within another
meeting, for such a big topic.)

    Brian

Harald Alvestrand wrote:
> Brian,
> 
> before asking for volunteers, you should state clearly whether you want 
> people who will:
> 
> - DOCUMENT the EXISTING way the IESG works, and seek approval for that
> - PROPOSE a NEW way the IESG can work, that fits the needs of the 
> community better
> 
> The last one is what draft-davies-pesci-next-steps-00 was trying to 
> suggest when it said:
> 
>   The most important single management role in the IETF at the moment
>   is that of the IESG, including the role of IETF Chair.  This should
>   therefore also receive the most scrutiny.  It's unreasonable to ask
>   people to grade their own performance, or to attempt to perform a
>   role at full speed while having to review how it could be done
>   otherwise.  Therefore, a review of the roles the IESG has should be
>   rooted outside the IESG - while asking current and former IESG
>   members for information and advice at every opportunity.
> 
>   This review should include:
> 
>   o  Creating a list of the tasks that currently gate on the IESG
>   o  Identifying any additional related tasks that might be appropriate
>      to improve efficiency and effectiveness
>   o  Making proposals for discarding or restructuring the existing
>      tasks in combination with the new tasks
>   o  Making a proposal for grouping those tasks into separate task
>      groups that can be assigned to different bodies at need.
>   o  Developing a proposal for how the standards development work of
>      the IETF should be partitioned to provide optimum efficiency while
>      allowing the IETF to take on all appropriate work.
>   o  Developing a suggestion for an initial set of bodies for handling
>      those tasks in the new work partitioning scheme, including, if
>      appropriate, a restructuring of the IESG.
>   o  Describing the process by which the set of bodies gets modified.
>   o  Describing how members of the proposed bodies get selected,
>      replaced, and (if needed) removed.
>   o  Proposing a structure for the documentation of the IETF process
>      that would result from their recommendations
> 
> Your words suggest a far more timid approach.
> 
>                     Harald
> 
> 
> 
> Brian E Carpenter wrote:
> 
>> People willing to work actively (i.e draft or
>> and edit) a document on this topic are
>> invited to contact me immediately. The objective
>> is to plan a mini-BOF during the General Area open
>> meeting at IETF 66. Without committed volunteers
>> in the community, this work will not happen.
>>
>> The IESG charter (RFC 3710) was intentionally published
>> as an Informational RFC to fill a known gap, without the
>> overhead and formality of a BCP. It may now be appropriate
>> to refine and adapt it, based on experience and changes
>> since RFC 3710 was published. At minimum, the creation
>> of IASA requires makes some updates necessary.
>> (Note that draft-carpenter-ietf-chair-tasks contains
>> some relevant comments.)
>>
>> RFC 3710 was produced by the IESG itself. I would certainly
>> want IESG members to be involved in any revision, but
>> it is important that members of the community also
>> take an active role, to ensure that the result meets
>> community expectations as well as practical reality.
>>
>>   Brian Carpenter
>>   General Area Director
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Ietf mailing list
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>> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf
>>
> 

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