Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting, BOM pollution?
Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com> Mon, 18 September 2017 21:59 UTC
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From: Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com>
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Subject: Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting, BOM pollution?
Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2017 17:59:19 -0400
In-Reply-To: <c76510f0-bf03-1393-9b35-082439cf466b@nostrum.com>
Cc: Julian Reschke <julian.reschke@gmx.de>, Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org>, ietf@ietf.org
To: Adam Roach <adam@nostrum.com>
References: <09b0ed8b-c47a-83c3-9174-cce990bdb145@rfc-editor.org> <00c301d32e41$e948f160$4001a8c0@gateway.2wire.net> <15e8698a857.c32afce7287357.8469431812243660972@ovsienko.info> <55215BEF-7520-4425-98F6-6BE1678F2C57@tzi.org> <15e874e49f1.c1362fb757242.2533006499702663721@ovsienko.info> <20170916153239.thscwu7ljiz37xcn@sources.org> <4815e600-7ec2-86a5-85ac-7ac508185881@gmx.de> <C1FD5021-9193-40FF-846D-B948407A6E41@tzi.org> <1d4033e5-48d2-b62c-d0a2-476ba7541034@nostrum.com> <c53bcaeb-f660-538e-f1f9-3aa213a77c3c@gmx.de> <68C17F98-15AB-4AA5-BB4B-B46D53C51585@fugue.com> <83c37ab2-51f7-9a94-2b86-2b4fbe1cd1d6@nostrum.com> <39EBEA6F-69B7-4B9A-9A72-761766628E1D@fugue.com> <019e429c-5332-b0c7-b895-08e64bae17cd@gmx.de> <A5DCDBE7-ED9B-4393-BAB2-F139C4139AA7@fugue.com> <8ccf8c64-a77a-3213-27ed-96691e77f827@gmx.de> <63813DDD-E2F2-43A6-A22C-CE55E6B9ED70@fugue.com> <689ea779-5a1a-e1b6-c7b1-307b5b3a0c52@gmx.de> <1682DE05-95A2-488F-9875-8EE5FB8C9943@fugue.com> <c76510f0-bf03-1393-9b35-082439cf466b@nostrum.com>
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On Sep 18, 2017, at 5:51 PM, Adam Roach <adam@nostrum.com> wrote: > I don't want to get in a protracted argument either, but I find your assertion that "it does cause problems" to be lacking concrete examples. Can you provide an existence proof of one such example? If you're right, it shouldn't be too hard. I'm taking Carsten at his word: he described some significant problems.
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… John C Klensin
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Julian Reschke
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Carsten Bormann
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Julian Reschke
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Carsten Bormann
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Julian Reschke
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Carsten Bormann
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Julian Reschke
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Julian Reschke
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Carsten Bormann
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Matthew Kerwin
- RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII cha… Heather Flanagan (RFC Series Editor)
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Masataka Ohta
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Heather Flanagan (RFC Series Editor)
- Re: [rfc-i] RFC Series publishes first RFC with n… HANSEN, TONY L
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… tom p.
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Denis Ovsienko
- Re: [rfc-i] RFC Series publishes first RFC with n… Patrik Fältström
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Carsten Bormann
- Re: Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-A… Denis Ovsienko
- Re: [rfc-i] RFC Series publishes first RFC with n… Mark Nottingham
- Re: [rfc-i] RFC Series publishes first RFC with n… Martin J. Dürst
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Martin J. Dürst
- Re: [rfc-i] RFC Series publishes first RFC with n… Patrik Fältström
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Masataka Ohta
- Brief history against non-ASCII RFCs (was Re: RFC… Masataka Ohta
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Carsten Bormann
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Lyndon Nerenberg
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Stephane Bortzmeyer
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Stephane Bortzmeyer
- Re: Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-A… Denis Ovsienko
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Masataka Ohta
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Benjamin Kaduk
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Masataka Ohta
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Masataka Ohta
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… tom p.
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Julian Reschke
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Julian Reschke
- Re: [rfc-i] RFC Series publishes first RFC with n… Tim Bray
- Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting, BOM… Carsten Bormann
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Tim Bray
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Julian Reschke
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Carsten Bormann
- Re: [rfc-i] RFC Series publishes first RFC with n… Jari Arkko
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Toerless Eckert
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Julian Reschke
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Stephane Bortzmeyer
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Toerless Eckert
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Toerless Eckert
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Julian Reschke
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Adam Roach
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Julian Reschke
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Julian Reschke
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Carsten Bormann
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Adam Roach
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Adam Roach
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Julian Reschke
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Adam Roach
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Julian Reschke
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Adam Roach
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Julian Reschke
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Adam Roach
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Adam Roach
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Julian Reschke
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Adam Roach
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Carsten Bormann
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Adam Roach
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Hardie
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Adam Roach
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Adam Roach
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Adam Roach
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Carsten Bormann
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Adam Roach
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Matthew Kerwin
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Adam Roach
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Lyndon Nerenberg
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- BOM-free tests [was Should the IETF be condoning,… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: BOM-free tests [was Should the IETF be condon… Ted Lemon
- Re: BOM-free tests [was Should the IETF be condon… tom p.
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… tom p.
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Heather Flanagan (RFC Series Editor)
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Carsten Bormann
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Paul Hoffman
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Carsten Bormann
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… John C Klensin
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Julian Reschke
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Julian Reschke
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… John C Klensin
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Julian Reschke
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Lyndon Nerenberg
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Julian Reschke
- Re: BOM-free tests [was Should the IETF be condon… Doug Royer
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: BOM-free tests [was Should the IETF be condon… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Matthew Kerwin
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… George Michaelson
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Ted Lemon
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… tom p.
- So do both [was Re: Should the IETF be condoning,… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Julian Reschke
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Heather Flanagan (RFC Series Editor)
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Julian Reschke
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Martin Thomson
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Matthew Kerwin
- Re: So do both [was Re: Should the IETF be condon… Matthew Kerwin
- Re: So do both [was Re: Should the IETF be condon… Carsten Bormann
- Re: So do both [was Re: Should the IETF be condon… Matthew Kerwin
- Re: So do both [was Re: Should the IETF be condon… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: So do both [was Re: Should the IETF be condon… tom p.
- Re: So do both [was Re: Should the IETF be condon… Matthew Kerwin
- Re: So do both [was Re: Should the IETF be condon… Julian Reschke
- Re: So do both [was Re: Should the IETF be condon… tom p.
- FTP and file transfers (was: Re: So do both [was … John C Klensin
- Re: FTP and file transfers (was: Re: So do both [… Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: FTP and file transfers Joe Touch
- Re: FTP and file transfers Nick Hilliard
- Re: FTP and file transfers John C Klensin
- Re: FTP and file transfers John C Klensin
- Re: FTP and file transfers Nick Hilliard
- Re: FTP and file transfers Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: FTP and file transfers Joe Touch
- Re: FTP and file transfers Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: FTP and file transfers Joe Touch
- Re: FTP and file transfers Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: FTP and file transfers Keith Moore
- Re: FTP and file transfers Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: FTP and file transfers Doug Royer
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Keith Moore
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Keith Moore
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Randy Bush
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Keith Moore
- Re: Should the IETF be condoning, even promoting,… Leif Johansson
- Re: So do both [was Re: Should the IETF be condon… John C Klensin
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… John Levine
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Keith Moore
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… John R Levine
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Keith Moore
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: So do both [was Re: Should the IETF be condon… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: So do both [was Re: Should the IETF be condon… Heather Flanagan (RFC Series Editor)
- Re: So do both [was Re: Should the IETF be condon… John C Klensin
- Re: So do both [was Re: Should the IETF be condon… Yoav Nir
- Re: So do both [was Re: Should the IETF be condon… Andrew G. Malis
- Re: page numbers or not, was So do both John Levine
- Re: So do both [was Re: Should the IETF be condon… Stewart Bryant
- Re: So do both [was Re: Should the IETF be condon… Joel M. Halpern
- Re: [rfc-i] RFC Series publishes first RFC with n… Frank Ellermann
- Re: RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII… Julian Reschke
- Re: [rfc-i] RFC Series publishes first RFC with n… Henrik Levkowetz