Re: Genart telechat review of draft-ietf-6man-rfc1981bis-06

Joe Touch <touch@isi.edu> Wed, 26 April 2017 18:35 UTC

Return-Path: <touch@isi.edu>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07FF4131586; Wed, 26 Apr 2017 11:35:43 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -6.901
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XcqK_u85ov-y; Wed, 26 Apr 2017 11:35:40 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from boreas.isi.edu (boreas.isi.edu [128.9.160.161]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B1782131582; Wed, 26 Apr 2017 11:35:40 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [128.9.184.33] ([128.9.184.33]) (authenticated bits=0) by boreas.isi.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id v3QIZDKk005153 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT); Wed, 26 Apr 2017 11:35:13 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: Genart telechat review of draft-ietf-6man-rfc1981bis-06
To: Stewart Bryant <stewart.bryant@gmail.com>, gen-art@ietf.org
Cc: ipv6@ietf.org, ietf@ietf.org, draft-ietf-6man-rfc1981bis.all@ietf.org
References: <149305392811.25808.15115824976388262628@ietfa.amsl.com> <497d3868-406a-a38f-56d8-391b0fc16032@isi.edu> <a974da1d-a9e7-8c64-8086-0955f2dffb12@gmail.com>
From: Joe Touch <touch@isi.edu>
Message-ID: <f6088ab8-3533-96f1-d9eb-f8462b1f4a1b@isi.edu>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2017 11:35:12 -0700
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.0.1
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <a974da1d-a9e7-8c64-8086-0955f2dffb12@gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Language: en-US
X-ISI-4-43-8-MailScanner: Found to be clean
X-MailScanner-From: touch@isi.edu
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/jxx03e8soAW17CWogz2RBVaPacs>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2017 18:35:43 -0000

Hi, Stewart,


On 4/26/2017 1:48 AM, Stewart Bryant wrote:
>
>
> On 25/04/2017 19:26, Joe Touch wrote:
>> Hi, Stewart,
>>
>> ...
>>
>>> SB>
>>> SB> Otherwise I would have thought that this was entirely a matter
>>> SB> for the host whether it wanted to use a Path MTU below the IPv6
>>> SB> link minimum. Nothing breaks if the host takes a more conservative
>>> SB> decision.
>> I don't agree; the host at that point is violating RFC2460. It should
>> never think that an IPv6 link or path with an MTU below what RFC2460
>> requires is valid.
>>
>> Joe
>>
>
> That is as maybe, but a host can do more or less what it wants, so
> this is surely an
> unenforceable constraint, or are you telling me that the receiving
> host MUST drop a
> fragment that is shorter than this? In which case the question whether
> in practice
> they do, and whether such a constraint is reasonable.

A "path MTU" is a value calculated from information from various sources
(attached links, ICMP messages, and perhaps other information), but IMO
it's never appropriate to set a "path MTU" smaller than the limit
established by IPv6 for a single link.

Individual packets and fragments can be smaller than the MTU, of course.
Nothing forces fragments to push up against any MTU limit at all. But I
would not describe that has a host changing its path MTU; it's just
sending packets.

Joe