Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR tag for RFC 5646 Language Tags
"Doug Ewell" <doug@ewellic.org> Thu, 15 May 2014 15:40 UTC
Return-Path: <doug@ewellic.org>
X-Original-To: ltru@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 137161A00DF for <ltru@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 15 May 2014 08:40:05 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.9
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Zi1uW0oGD3Up for <ltru@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 15 May 2014 08:40:03 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from p3plwbeout03-02.prod.phx3.secureserver.net (p3plsmtp03-02-2.prod.phx3.secureserver.net [72.167.218.214]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 923361A008D for <ltru@ietf.org>; Thu, 15 May 2014 08:40:03 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from localhost ([72.167.218.245]) by p3plwbeout03-02.prod.phx3.secureserver.net with bizsmtp id 2Ffw1o0035JG3DC01FfwTq; Thu, 15 May 2014 08:39:56 -0700
X-SID: 2Ffw1o0035JG3DC01
Received: (qmail 29233 invoked by uid 99); 15 May 2014 15:39:56 -0000
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
X-Originating-IP: 208.51.143.189
User-Agent: Workspace Webmail 5.6.47
Message-Id: <20140515083955.665a7a7059d7ee80bb4d670165c8327d.b69c089194.wbe@email03.secureserver.net>
From: Doug Ewell <doug@ewellic.org>
To: Dave Cridland <dave@cridland.net>
Date: Thu, 15 May 2014 08:39:55 -0700
Mime-Version: 1.0
Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ltru/u_3YextF2L7GwVxlwtZGckU71rs
Cc: LTRU Working Group <ltru@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR tag for RFC 5646 Language Tags
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list <ltru.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ltru>, <mailto:ltru-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ltru/>
List-Post: <mailto:ltru@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ltru-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru>, <mailto:ltru-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 15 May 2014 15:40:05 -0000
Dave Cridland <dave at cridland dot net> wrote: > Of course, an invalid-UTF-8 based proposal simply means that it's no > longer UTF-8 per-se, and so needs itself to be tagged differently. > Other than that, I don't see it's a bad idea from a technical > standpoint. The use of the word "invalid" probably scares people, but > I note that's really a shorthand for "not backwards compatible by > existing UTF-8 processors". The proposal from 1997 ("MLSF") did call it an extra layer on top of UTF-8, and included lots of health warnings that it was not really UTF-8. That didn't remove the danger, though, because it looked so much like UTF-8. John's response about decoders was spot-on. > Exactly the same caveats apply to Plane 14 tagging, mind, and > moreover, we could invent our own - indeed, that's what we're doing by > having these arrays of (tag, string) tuples. Since CBOR processors are likely to be bespoke, as you said, but the underlying UTF-8 processor is not -- as you also said -- it would be much easier to strip out Plane 14 characters for display if necessary than to implement a whole new UTF-8–like decoding-stream layer that understands MLSF. As Mark knows, I never bought into the deprecation argument about how evil Plane 14 tag characters are. Handling them correctly just isn't that difficult. For CBOR, you may be better off with the tag/string tuples; the tags in that case are much easier to see and don't need to be stripped from the string for display or comparison. But if this "tagged text" model is too far out of step with the CBOR/JSON way of thinking, Plane 14 is out there. -- Doug Ewell | Thornton, CO, USA http://ewellic.org | @DougEwell
- [Ltru] Fwd: [apps-discuss] Defining a CBOR tag fo… Ira McDonald
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: [apps-discuss] Defining a CBOR ta… John Cowan
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: [apps-discuss] Defining a CBOR ta… Randy Presuhn
- Re: [Ltru] Fwd: [apps-discuss] Defining a CBOR ta… Peter Occil
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR ta… Peter Occil
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR ta… Dave Cridland
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR ta… Carsten Bormann
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR ta… Mark Davis ☕️
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR ta… John Cowan
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR ta… Doug Ewell
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR ta… Mark Davis ☕️
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR ta… Doug Ewell
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR ta… Peter Occil
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR ta… Dave Cridland
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR ta… John Cowan
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR ta… Dave Cridland
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR ta… Doug Ewell
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Defining a CBOR tag for… Peter Occil
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR ta… Mark Davis ☕️
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR ta… Doug Ewell
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR ta… Mark Davis ☕️
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Fwd: Defining a CBOR ta… Martin J. Dürst
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Defining a CBOR tag for… Peter Occil
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Defining a CBOR tag for… Carsten Bormann
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Defining a CBOR tag for… Peter Occil
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Defining a CBOR tag for… Joe Hildebrand (jhildebr)
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Defining a CBOR tag for… Peter Occil
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Defining a CBOR tag for… Doug Ewell
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Defining a CBOR tag for… Peter Occil
- Re: [Ltru] [apps-discuss] Defining a CBOR tag for… Peter Occil