Re: [Manycouches] ways to slow list traffic down

Mike Bishop <mbishop@evequefou.be> Tue, 27 August 2019 15:11 UTC

Return-Path: <mbishop@evequefou.be>
X-Original-To: manycouches@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: manycouches@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58B4E120830 for <manycouches@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 27 Aug 2019 08:11:02 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.9
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=evequefou.onmicrosoft.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id M3wkua03w2C3 for <manycouches@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 27 Aug 2019 08:10:58 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from NAM05-DM3-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-dm3nam05on0726.outbound.protection.outlook.com [IPv6:2a01:111:f400:fe51::726]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 30367120827 for <manycouches@ietf.org>; Tue, 27 Aug 2019 08:10:57 -0700 (PDT)
ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=PxqCvOAdj3AuIXGRfoeFy3D2bCiyVaeo9xI7YNQJaX1ZtsGRd5u5tFW6SMLMSI8FMZXdOXbk+wLEcJ8Ux1G4FO3UqtG4fWbGXA1I7BkIldTzfqA4c3qC8sm5oSUTXldhPK3y4D8cNrdjjYl+q7t0LWQRr7APyD5y6vIdexq90VjsabeD8AEd8dpkX/cR/iSnK6HqhZtnJ49zv5sCKn13pzjMDIktBZd6CY8+T1zdVR/z3Vq0lXw+ekBzE6GaFm2XlJPBp5L80c0IpKREuerQ52v2nRwIvem+7muH+4Mw+y17I4h4u5C5Vcof80mKKrbP5Oa5bOdZhb4QPeSGfAFqKQ==
ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=9uinDXTZoGfn34ml6Di8Wsfw6w3nu8qAHVVnXHnwtWE=; b=irdjwP+2M3hOzg0JFExE8kMksbFfjpv2Sd0xjU0ILUbhNOPgciI6LyqPldBO1zcNC3MHGbQYkKKi2qOY1LTPQnNNuVzPwg0V87caq4fDOk5KttXJSvP4D6UZKHMKUBEiHVJssJYK4l2umCW4dfniJxE3XrBRJOtDIL8nx07sq3dzGo2HhnEdpS++TJrZtyNyUNaSJlES02lWIcxjwueB4L+eLwPhUq4ZZ3KuTpPr3Qq/INq4F7u4qbfrtluMr2IUiiJYnX35im9z151rahrsbdoTHFJA8tDu7OP1z31+wI4ies9s96edhx2iZdGaOw8AssDe5o1B7xry/uJzzfl/IA==
ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=evequefou.be; dmarc=pass action=none header.from=evequefou.be; dkim=pass header.d=evequefou.be; arc=none
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=evequefou.onmicrosoft.com; s=selector2-evequefou-onmicrosoft-com; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=9uinDXTZoGfn34ml6Di8Wsfw6w3nu8qAHVVnXHnwtWE=; b=KT47R5pMTggMbCyl1Ckgk/QnoeLA4oLa+BNnf3f5mOQevzRbvT3Lj8s3km3Hj6CcZf/Eu+lv36uDFJbPmhOhdrZrrms6wLnBEhj5KtLK4oAh0oICzN383wu0gKQ3EdWyW1RdnRp9yK5GYEtTZFyBDz7cR3wqBfI0klQZ81SjNWo=
Received: from BN6PR2201MB1202.namprd22.prod.outlook.com (10.174.80.146) by BN6PR2201MB1089.namprd22.prod.outlook.com (10.174.86.157) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.2199.21; Tue, 27 Aug 2019 15:10:54 +0000
Received: from BN6PR2201MB1202.namprd22.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::b191:8036:dc83:9103]) by BN6PR2201MB1202.namprd22.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::b191:8036:dc83:9103%12]) with mapi id 15.20.2199.021; Tue, 27 Aug 2019 15:10:54 +0000
From: Mike Bishop <mbishop@evequefou.be>
To: Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca>, "manycouches@ietf.org" <manycouches@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Manycouches] ways to slow list traffic down
Thread-Index: AQHVXEFErd+SFKAzQEWCYpDCVrZdX6cNzrGAgABcBoCAAO+xUA==
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2019 15:10:53 +0000
Message-ID: <BN6PR2201MB12028020542DAE5A3AB0DF58DAA00@BN6PR2201MB1202.namprd22.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CALaySJLnbGLLOuFtzf_wAPdsZVg39m4znGnj4CDj1Gj5Yyi+pQ@mail.gmail.com> <22460.1566841385@localhost> <f12a3751-3c24-2cbd-fda4-f0e17dc87855@network-heretics.com> <56e7d656-97fe-8291-5564-a6bb8278140e@gmail.com> <23239.1566867111@localhost>
In-Reply-To: <23239.1566867111@localhost>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=mbishop@evequefou.be;
x-originating-ip: [2600:2b00:931f:a301:3d16:a08a:4717:e777]
x-ms-publictraffictype: Email
x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: f164e2af-49bb-436b-275b-08d72b00c162
x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(2390118)(7020095)(4652040)(7021145)(8989299)(4534185)(7022145)(4603075)(4627221)(201702281549075)(8990200)(7048125)(7024125)(7027125)(7023125)(5600166)(711020)(4605104)(1401327)(2017052603328)(7193020); SRVR:BN6PR2201MB1089;
x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: BN6PR2201MB1089:
x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: <BN6PR2201MB10896CD01B7CF93622FB6456DAA00@BN6PR2201MB1089.namprd22.prod.outlook.com>
x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:8882;
x-forefront-prvs: 0142F22657
x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(39830400003)(346002)(396003)(376002)(136003)(366004)(13464003)(199004)(189003)(71200400001)(9686003)(99286004)(6116002)(6506007)(53546011)(508600001)(305945005)(25786009)(102836004)(74316002)(5660300002)(11346002)(14454004)(71190400001)(7696005)(446003)(76176011)(52536014)(7736002)(8676002)(46003)(2501003)(8936002)(6436002)(33656002)(256004)(6246003)(316002)(81166006)(53936002)(476003)(66946007)(229853002)(66476007)(2906002)(66556008)(64756008)(76116006)(486006)(81156014)(186003)(66446008)(86362001)(14444005)(110136005)(55016002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:BN6PR2201MB1089; H:BN6PR2201MB1202.namprd22.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; LANG:en; PTR:InfoNoRecords; A:1; MX:1;
received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: evequefou.be does not designate permitted sender hosts)
x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1
x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: xKycYaWrglrYdVhPTZlqnF2hDahsf8D1fKO/VB/4vV9ODS97x67W4NJ5JsqRdZISzQz1v0OobN+9vjMfa4bns6KRQ1RAPbTwQrje065hLx4XcsZ9mzCBthBCgD0fIHZ8tR+SMS1DK+xZ2eXLPsDvKyxaa/LhTmg08zhHvnqCtfY2knQWs5YAzLD/Yr3jZ8YB8WPBxEZyxZX8+pk9o1GQWtY1bmIlTZXkQZipIa1PlmOnmuCul2K5YwbbtEVPbxWQ2CmjlPfRFddXUsnUJsI7Ffn6WJtBWjRT0xNtUT7BfnSlUk/sHjeyYpRI3pfAdR//+0LJ6xEtm7c0uwSX+U8gym1DpqlIuT64K9qRkmb3gKsVEih+EUzuElB3Bdvqrk47KD5Nz2QP7/9+Po02yh6OFj0UgdMOTS50ZQThOA3MkCE=
x-ms-exchange-transport-forked: True
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-OriginatorOrg: evequefou.be
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: f164e2af-49bb-436b-275b-08d72b00c162
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 27 Aug 2019 15:10:53.8555 (UTC)
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 41eaf50b-882d-47eb-8c4c-0b5b76a9da8f
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: 2NQNG6ZbskzJ7pAIf/xA+ANQCUs4EdnKdwxyqnE+uQ0Mj4QPFSz6y1DTuHkggl1Z8KHZa7f/zNO6Q0Lr/LW2Xw==
X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: BN6PR2201MB1089
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/manycouches/TeuxDYTL6XHIBL9wPWzsnWRPMqs>
Subject: Re: [Manycouches] ways to slow list traffic down
X-BeenThere: manycouches@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: "List is a design team list to identify issues that would arise should an IETF meeting ever be held with O\(1000\) 'remote' participants." <manycouches.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/manycouches>, <mailto:manycouches-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/manycouches/>
List-Post: <mailto:manycouches@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:manycouches-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manycouches>, <mailto:manycouches-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2019 15:11:03 -0000

For actual new topics, sure.  I won't mention the list, but I recently had someone changing the subject on every reply; made the conversation nearly impossible to follow.

-----Original Message-----
From: Manycouches <manycouches-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Michael Richardson
Sent: Monday, August 26, 2019 8:52 PM
To: manycouches@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Manycouches] ways to slow list traffic down


Melinda Shore <melinda.shore@gmail.com> wrote:
    >> But a quota might also do more harm than good, though, because batched
    >> replies would make it harder to keep track of individual threads and
    >> issues.

    > I think it's important for thinking about these sorts of issues to
    > include incentives among the various considerations, and I do think
    > that quotas will tend to incentivize long, multi-topic pieces of mail.
    > I'm actually not sure I love moderating every post, either, but we'll
    > see how things go and what we learn with the add experiment.

ideally, it would be nice to be able to limit replies on a per-thread basis.
That way, the batched replies would deal with a common topic.

The obvious hack is to start new threads for new topics.  That in of itself might be a positive thing.

--
Michael Richardson <mcr+IETF@sandelman.ca>, Sandelman Software Works  -= IPv6 IoT consulting =-