Re: [mpls] I-D Action: draft-ietf-mpls-mna-requirements-05.txt

Hi Haoyu,
I believe that the value of IOAM, as an example of on-path OAM, has been
recognized and well acknowledged. But it is important to separate the
benefits of IOAM to produce operational state and telemetry information
from how that information may be transported for the processing. As Rakesh
has pointed out during the joint meeting, Incremental Trace Option is
outside the scope already. To me, that is the demonstration of a pragmatic
approach to applying IOAM in an MPLS network. Next, if we compare
Pre-allocated and Edge-to-Edge with the Direct Export, I don't see any gap
in the ability to collect operational state and telemetry information.
Hence, I conclude that functionally IOAM-DEX is on par with Pre-allocated
and E2E trace options. Also, as I've noted in the presentation, IOAM-DEX
allows for more accurate measurement of transit delay (residence time).
Hence, it seems only practical supporting only IOAM-DEX in an MPLS network
to use as an on-path OAM tool (of course, the Alternate Marking method is
an interesting and useful mechanism that should be discussed). And IOAM-DEX
can adequately supported based on the WG-adopted draft-ietf-mpls-mna-hdr.
Hence, I cannot find anything supporting the need for PSD in MNA as far as
IOAM in MPLS is concerned.

Regards,
Greg

On Tue, Mar 28, 2023 at 12:06 PM Haoyu Song <haoyu.song@futurewei.com>
wrote:

> I think we should keep PSD. There are already use cases for PSD
> documented. IOAM Trace has its own merits even though alternatives exist
> (otherwise we shouldn’t have it standardized at the first place).
>
> Also, I believe MNA should be flexible and forwarding looking. MNA is a
> big change to MPLS so it’s critical to make it right. If we leave it now it
> would be costly to add it in the future. If we have the mechanism supported
> now, whether use it or not will become a business choice.
>
>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Haoyu
>
>
>
> *From:* mpls <mpls-bounces@ietf.org> *On Behalf Of *Joel Halpern
> *Sent:* Monday, March 27, 2023 8:55 PM
> *To:* Matthew Bocci (Nokia) <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>; mpls@ietf.org;
> i-d-announce@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [mpls] I-D Action: draft-ietf-mpls-mna-requirements-05.txt
>
>
>
> I don't want to hold up the requirements document.  But....
>
> The document does not currently justify the requirement for post-stack
> data, in terms of the inherent tradeoff between value and complexity.  I
> wonder if the discussion of PSD should be removed from the document
> entirely, leaving it for further WG discussion.
>
> Yours,
>
> Joel
>
> On 3/27/2023 6:25 AM, Matthew Bocci (Nokia) wrote:
>
> WG,
>
>
>
> I have just posted an updated version of the MNA requirements draft. There
> are very few changes in this draft.
>
>    1. Clearly identified the editor, per the request from the MPLS WG
>    chairs.
>    2. Cleaned up a few editor’s notes.
>    3. Added a minor clarification to the wording of Section 3.4 Paragraph
>    8: location of post stack ancillary data->location of any post stack
>    ancillary data).
>
>
>
> The authors reviewed the text and did not find any other significant
> issues that might not be in line with the outcome of recent WG adoption
> polls, but please let us know if you see anything of concern.
>
>
>
> Best regards,
>
>
>
> Matthew
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From: *mpls <mpls-bounces@ietf.org> <mpls-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of
> internet-drafts@ietf.org <internet-drafts@ietf.org>
> <internet-drafts@ietf.org>
> *Date: *Monday, 27 March 2023 at 11:14
> *To: *i-d-announce@ietf.org <i-d-announce@ietf.org>
> <i-d-announce@ietf.org>
> *Cc: *mpls@ietf.org <mpls@ietf.org> <mpls@ietf.org>
> *Subject: *[mpls] I-D Action: draft-ietf-mpls-mna-requirements-05.txt
>
>
> CAUTION: This is an external email. Please be very careful when clicking
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> <https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnok.it%2Fext&data=05%7C01%7Chaoyu.song%40futurewei.com%7Cdc56fff3f9ed49c8162f08db2f2718f4%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C638155617221780214%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=xHcaJBrEN5i3fNvzc1%2BiWpVLEF7W57Y5s%2B0fJh3YKbg%3D&reserved=0>
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>
>
> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories. This Internet-Draft is a work item of the Multiprotocol Label
> Switching (MPLS) WG of the IETF.
>
>    Title           : Requirements for MPLS Network Actions
>    Authors         : Matthew Bocci
>                      Stewart Bryant
>                      John Drake
>    Filename        : draft-ietf-mpls-mna-requirements-05.txt
>    Pages           : 12
>    Date            : 2023-03-27
>
> Abstract:
>    This document specifies requirements for MPLS network actions which
>    affect the forwarding or other processing of MPLS packets.  These
>    requirements are derived from a number of proposals for additions to
>    the MPLS label stack to allow forwarding or other processing
>    decisions to be made, either by a transit or terminating LSR (i.e.
>    the LER).
>
> The IETF datatracker status page for this Internet-Draft is:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-mpls-mna-requirements/
> <https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdatatracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-ietf-mpls-mna-requirements%2F&data=05%7C01%7Chaoyu.song%40futurewei.com%7Cdc56fff3f9ed49c8162f08db2f2718f4%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C638155617221780214%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=8t9ttHCPuatz%2B9FwuI79bVX1Q3R2B5M2DGH8TcxXyiY%3D&reserved=0>
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> There is also an htmlized version available at:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-mpls-mna-requirements-05
> <https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdatatracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fhtml%2Fdraft-ietf-mpls-mna-requirements-05&data=05%7C01%7Chaoyu.song%40futurewei.com%7Cdc56fff3f9ed49c8162f08db2f2718f4%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C638155617221936427%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=0wgoRAl9dkNT3l5kJcy7yw4wNKKNIvnX0fUMOJ4pZpY%3D&reserved=0>
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> A diff from the previous version is available at:
>
> https://author-tools.ietf.org/iddiff?url2=draft-ietf-mpls-mna-requirements-05
> <https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fauthor-tools.ietf.org%2Fiddiff%3Furl2%3Ddraft-ietf-mpls-mna-requirements-05&data=05%7C01%7Chaoyu.song%40futurewei.com%7Cdc56fff3f9ed49c8162f08db2f2718f4%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C638155617221936427%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=ZhyJL%2FCmmxLAT8fIu6ODkOU1%2BTqkr1x9eQlkkUk3dxI%3D&reserved=0>
>
> Internet-Drafts are also available by rsync at rsync.ietf.org:
> :internet-drafts
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