Spin Bit -- a Path Forward

Mark Nottingham <mnot@mnot.net> Fri, 23 March 2018 14:20 UTC

Return-Path: <mnot@mnot.net>
X-Original-To: quic@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: quic@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 039D212E053 for <quic@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 23 Mar 2018 07:20:29 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.701
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.701 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=mnot.net header.b=PxyovATz; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com header.b=Duvw4HjI
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jDuDAU_Uf5tq for <quic@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 23 Mar 2018 07:20:26 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from out5-smtp.messagingengine.com (out5-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.29]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B79B112DA42 for <quic@ietf.org>; Fri, 23 Mar 2018 07:20:26 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from compute3.internal (compute3.nyi.internal [10.202.2.43]) by mailout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 98D1E20DB5; Fri, 23 Mar 2018 10:20:25 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from frontend2 ([10.202.2.161]) by compute3.internal (MEProxy); Fri, 23 Mar 2018 10:20:25 -0400
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=mnot.net; h=cc :content-transfer-encoding:content-type:date:from:message-id :mime-version:subject:to:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s= fm2; bh=+3JM1MVkSHsPlJ1ZsdOvDNwZ9bqHS/D9sIBGSP9NwSM=; b=PxyovATz gFv2AMUTvHd065KJvTNnIDgk7/JBkodJDkNXxNpFXiQPbtF6lELzCHleNo+WycVy 5KCvswUOdPMe7dGJ4b82u88zq/MZQSYE9Rfqw4dNGfql6Y98wVkE06Dik8EXhTOe 6WqzgKDi7GtTvtkj/L6KoV3TeUg03RVg31Gt+fjrlnt4xAyIR7rfWF3BQxxRTS3q DT+zT5LmrtNx1LCBicdax1OaIzro8EzvL4mGw2rF3snOZAp043f4G2xa9WEQDshG E42ZZfEDnlfWCzgZlnlfCYb0sPJCy4HrCOEPXglxRZ7gZ7WLjW0eFxTPUUovsYP1 2VaN+PiTRuOjOA==
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:content-transfer-encoding:content-type :date:from:message-id:mime-version:subject:to:x-me-sender :x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm2; bh=+3JM1MVkSHsPlJ1ZsdOvDNwZ9bqHS /D9sIBGSP9NwSM=; b=Duvw4HjILnObdjaWAbV6TVECa9BBG+kPjh98eLqQDje6M yVl1bAVYe9i7CJGmgRqN59wFnRsCgxPeyUbIgfwXCOyxfbJCgi/kuGewhdqWD4TS ZlthOIDpgl0aH9B73WZNVm8Z/lJn7rruHnOZr+ang8B5DXh1PUGFEpqeVHQG0N1d YsT3DVGirswHJwDLX7bdPlDpdCeljTJpZPJyGdK3poEIvW8z9CUiAUM+sjU6F9Op x/rF9T/nTdMgfLtduQu4u6MhpxFxbcJn/2zy/uqpOEWNCAJXvo5Gr6eBThlWlOAn Qg4ccclH8lWJvTejbGTy46NQBYd5LQ6dSxdaFuHpg==
X-ME-Sender: <xms:KQ21WoWKDfmbyxVvuyOrlzsTVpWHC1E3Je7e07yFP1bJHy8BiyQyKQ>
Received: from dhcp-959f.meeting.ietf.org (dhcp-959f.meeting.ietf.org [31.133.149.159]) by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id A57AD240CE; Fri, 23 Mar 2018 10:20:24 -0400 (EDT)
From: Mark Nottingham <mnot@mnot.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.2 \(3445.5.20\))
Subject: Spin Bit -- a Path Forward
Message-Id: <D90555C7-CE24-4073-8E85-E05CFF2D645E@mnot.net>
Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2018 14:20:23 +0000
Cc: Lars Eggert <lars@eggert.org>
To: IETF QUIC WG <quic@ietf.org>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.5.20)
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/quic/O8yuITG8QU9-e_lC0tsZoApT_7M>
X-BeenThere: quic@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22
Precedence: list
List-Id: Main mailing list of the IETF QUIC working group <quic.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/quic>, <mailto:quic-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/quic/>
List-Post: <mailto:quic@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:quic-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/quic>, <mailto:quic-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2018 14:20:31 -0000

In London, Thursday's discussion ended up with a plan where:

- The transport draft editors will assure that at least three bits are available for experimentation in the next draft
- A separate WG document (but not milestone, yet) would be written that would document how to use one of those bits to measure RTT (the "Spin Bit")
- That document would be an optional part of our upcoming Implementation Draft milestones, to encourage implementation and experimentation
- However, the "core" documents will NOT yet be affected in any way, beyond the accommodation of bits above
- Before publishing QUICv1, we'd revisit the status of that document to determine what to do with that document (as well as any other proposals that emerge and have a similar level of review).

This gives us more time to get experience, explore possible alternatives (provided they have adequate review) and assess implementation support, without putting it on our critical path. The final decision regarding the destiny of those bits in QUICv1 (or other possible extensions, versions, etc. to meet these uses) will depend upon the implementation take-up, breadth and quality of experiences reported, and amount and diversity of data collected in our experimentation.

If there is enough interest in using more than one bit for determining RTT (e.g., Brian's VEC), or another proposal, we'll spin up a Design Team to evaluate the privacy implications of doing so (taking into consideration decisions about Packet Number Encryption).

The above is an expanded version of what we discussed in the room (time was constrained). We believe that the sense of the room supported this path forward pretty strongly. If you disagree -- either with the characterisation of what was discussed above, or with the proposed path forward -- please explain why.

Regards,

--
Mark and Lars, WG Chairs