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Re: Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-piraux-quic-additional-addresses-00.txt

Michael Eriksson <michael.eriksson@ericsson.com> Wed, 19 October 2022 07:55 UTC

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From: Michael Eriksson <michael.eriksson@ericsson.com>
To: David Schinazi <dschinazi.ietf@gmail.com>
CC: Martin Thomson <mt@lowentropy.net>, IETF QUIC WG <quic@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-piraux-quic-additional-addresses-00.txt
Thread-Topic: Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-piraux-quic-additional-addresses-00.txt
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Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2022 07:55:35 +0000
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Hi David,

I can see the point with random constants, even though I think the risk for collisions is pretty small in practice -- especially in controlled experiments. What is more important is what Christian Huitema discusses in another message: to change the constants when the protocol evolves, at least when the spec is stable enough that you reach interop testing.

The reason I mention the multipath draft is of course that it is a wg document that has gone through a few revisions. If you think the constants are important, you should probably start there and not when someone presents a new idea for the first time for discussion.

BTW, the One True Way to generate random numbers is to hex dump /dev/urandom :-).

/me

________________________________
From: David Schinazi <dschinazi.ietf@gmail.com><mailto:dschinazi.ietf@gmail.com>
To: Michael Eriksson <michael.eriksson@ericsson.com><mailto:michael.eriksson@ericsson.com>
Cc: Martin Thomson <mt@lowentropy.net><mailto:mt@lowentropy.net>, IETF QUIC WG <quic@ietf.org><mailto:quic@ietf.org>
Subject: Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-piraux-quic-additional-addresses-00.txt
Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2022 20:28:20 +0200 (Central European Summer Time)

Hi Michael,

While MT's comment might sound nitpicky, he's right in suggesting people use real PNRGs because we've already had collisions due to human-picked numbers in the past. The fact that quic-multipath made the same mistake doesn't make it best practice. (And FWIW I'm also guilty of having made that mistake in the past).

David

On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 2:28 AM Michael Eriksson <michael.eriksson=40ericsson.com@dmarc.ietf.org<mailto:40ericsson.com@dmarc.ietf.org>> wrote:
On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 11:13:24 +1100, Martin Thomson wrote:
 > I see this in the draft:
 >
 > "TBD - experiments use 0xadda"
 >
 > I find it hard to believe that this value was chosen at random.
 > Please consult a random number generator for these values. And -
 > while you are developing proposals - larger values might be more
 > appropriate.

That was a pretty nitpicky comment... Have you read
draft-ietf-quic-multipath? The 0xbabaXX constants don't look very
random if you consider the affiliation of the first authors.

Also, what is a "large" value? 0xadda is big enough to require a
32-bit VarInt.

/me

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