IETF Logo Mail Archive

[rfc-i] NO policy in Style Guide, please (was: Re: Guidance on linking added to the Web Portion of the Style Guide)

"Martin J. Dürst" <duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp> Wed, 21 February 2024 23:09 UTC

Return-Path: <duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp>
X-Original-To: rfc-interest@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: rfc-interest@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C26D7C151527; Wed, 21 Feb 2024 15:09:48 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.907
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.907 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, URIBL_DBL_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, URIBL_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=itaoyama.onmicrosoft.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ahKCkpNC0YFR; Wed, 21 Feb 2024 15:09:45 -0800 (PST)
Received: from JPN01-TYC-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-tycjpn01on20701.outbound.protection.outlook.com [IPv6:2a01:111:f403:2019::701]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BE487C151538; Wed, 21 Feb 2024 15:09:43 -0800 (PST)
ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=LSUyuHlfrZQyMjybdCNvUeX/6wmzFjqJA8/LSW8w1LNLTIO3p2qegt5XlDOaEHMnvsG9xGiKbHh8YxIsEGe3mzvFLLpNzV+zMTYXRiniL4cN6mqTaA8HzWLF8IojPZPUF+flIWEAXDgn0BOFTnIcWwmzkHsHeRt/tBNlI1E7HtKczJAXTLCTl5VapGNSDy/AUdXeKfPim2hoZCBHi5pzGyWqkmF3ruN3qvGddBuW/YdH4CqVSUttE4qWq6oKSbsYiimkowzbrkT2oW+qwMqfPJjv7ARvbOEFxpH7Fr+a0Over6dmzIyn4GGUW+OGa77a+w33W/KyEEoX40wnLWuTRA==
ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-ChunkCount:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-0:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-1; bh=tKwd6Q0vPwNko3wUdK7LYJt0SCi+RhQLiTI+lO5bQHk=; b=Se7YYDnmbCkwRo2/t0DDqJt/XLZAa6vKfOkzvaCaYm+fEA83Ck8UfXqu3oZfk1YuOChvlsQUpUivWDg9xJrZd/9VbD0/lSWNPVjUctkZt669NOhZq8oxYjX0OL2OrK+ZYR+cLVpHyN+RZSz5g+Nq8WQh/cdqX6055VB0DrwbojBTqM9XV2HRdR4Ma2iJ6PkOdBLSp+3gidkPXPAsFMrkvK8cQUdq8tVkl4yPGLfvRodqpfya4yEKQMJtR0LEKtPRBjEpPW22Q/FcuW3MiSKJodcSVnXLKi0M7HQnmY1cPqELjfStBWUs+12EWNc13O/JAPrtp0uJl0rv9TRpLOy7vA==
ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=it.aoyama.ac.jp; dmarc=pass action=none header.from=it.aoyama.ac.jp; dkim=pass header.d=it.aoyama.ac.jp; arc=none
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=itaoyama.onmicrosoft.com; s=selector2-itaoyama-onmicrosoft-com; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=tKwd6Q0vPwNko3wUdK7LYJt0SCi+RhQLiTI+lO5bQHk=; b=Ck3WTYC+JWnsmwKjS5TvBLEEAaA96qjqXy+O7J9/mdyxjk1udeG+MoBmDuChOTM5OaOIqOtwTfHrxqQDQA6OoBULsR0d4ulm5ZmJXVgu9ITSTToXyhd5i8DXvymOtNo2eT7ZnapS4VOgwPWh2l5aCzd3js/C4h4vuoU6WAtI23c=
Authentication-Results: dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;dmarc=none action=none header.from=it.aoyama.ac.jp;
Received: from OS7PR01MB11468.jpnprd01.prod.outlook.com (2603:1096:604:23c::10) by OS3PR01MB5814.jpnprd01.prod.outlook.com (2603:1096:604:c6::9) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.7316.21; Wed, 21 Feb 2024 23:09:41 +0000
Received: from OS7PR01MB11468.jpnprd01.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::3eee:cf9e:63a2:2649]) by OS7PR01MB11468.jpnprd01.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::3eee:cf9e:63a2:2649%4]) with mapi id 15.20.7292.036; Wed, 21 Feb 2024 23:09:41 +0000
Message-ID: <d4ceb0b0-b361-4fbc-9a42-8e2780851b79@it.aoyama.ac.jp>
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2024 08:09:39 +0900
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Content-Language: en-US
To: Jean Mahoney <jmahoney@amsl.com>, RFC Interest <rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>, "rswg@rfc-editor.org" <rswg@rfc-editor.org>
References: <b00b1540-1c8c-4ef5-ba12-7949d444ad35@amsl.com>
From: "Martin J. Dürst" <duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp>
Organization: Aoyama Gakuin University
In-Reply-To: <b00b1540-1c8c-4ef5-ba12-7949d444ad35@amsl.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"; format="flowed"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-ClientProxiedBy: TYWP286CA0009.JPNP286.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (2603:1096:400:178::7) To OS7PR01MB11468.jpnprd01.prod.outlook.com (2603:1096:604:23c::10)
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-MS-PublicTrafficType: Email
X-MS-TrafficTypeDiagnostic: OS7PR01MB11468:EE_|OS3PR01MB5814:EE_
X-MS-Office365-Filtering-Correlation-Id: b9587a46-4b43-4a0c-a5fd-08dc33322f3a
X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck: 1
X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-Relay: 0
X-Microsoft-Antispam: BCL:0;
X-Microsoft-Antispam-Message-Info: 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
X-Forefront-Antispam-Report: CIP:255.255.255.255; CTRY:; LANG:en; SCL:1; SRV:; IPV:NLI; SFV:NSPM; H:OS7PR01MB11468.jpnprd01.prod.outlook.com; PTR:; CAT:NONE; SFS:(13230031); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102;
X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-ChunkCount: 1
X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-0: 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
X-OriginatorOrg: it.aoyama.ac.jp
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: b9587a46-4b43-4a0c-a5fd-08dc33322f3a
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: OS7PR01MB11468.jpnprd01.prod.outlook.com
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Feb 2024 23:09:41.4550 (UTC)
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-FromEntityHeader: Hosted
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Id: e02030e7-4d45-463e-a968-0290e738c18e
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-MailboxType: HOSTED
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-UserPrincipalName: lNtCr89ZueQNNHkngtZ/N1dOTeb+TMovusHvWifZ/VXJnM+0t6SvOlwQeYKG5WVsvB4uT7YnVqmrvheK7Xs4tQ==
X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: OS3PR01MB5814
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/rfc-interest/FtEjZR_DW9yTBrVl924f3j7cMzw>
Subject: [rfc-i] NO policy in Style Guide, please (was: Re: Guidance on linking added to the Web Portion of the Style Guide)
X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.39
Precedence: list
List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." <rfc-interest.rfc-editor.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://mailman.rfc-editor.org/mailman/options/rfc-interest>, <mailto:rfc-interest-request@rfc-editor.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/rfc-interest/>
List-Post: <mailto:rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>
List-Help: <mailto:rfc-interest-request@rfc-editor.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://mailman.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest>, <mailto:rfc-interest-request@rfc-editor.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2024 23:09:48 -0000

Hello Jean, others,

[copying RSWG]

On 2024-02-21 23:37, Jean Mahoney wrote:
> Hi all,
> 
> The RPC has added guidance on the use of links in documents. Please see 
> the Web Portion of the Style Guide at
> <https://www.rfc-editor.org/styleguide/part2/#links>.

Thanks for the pointer. I have comments on a few items. I'll use a 
separate mail for each of them.

The text you point to says:
"There is no hard limit on the number and frequency of links in 
documents, and a limit should not be defined by policy."

I definitely agree with the substance of this sentence. However, there's 
a very big problem here. There are continuing occasional discussions in 
the RSWG about what is and isn't, or should and shouldn't, be policy 
(for which the RSWG is responsible) and what not.

My personal take on this is that "we will know it when we see it", and 
"whatever the RSWG thinks is policy is policy", so my position is that 
abstract discussions about the border of policy are mostly a waste of time.

However, it is very clear that it's the RSWG that defines policy 
(whatever that is), which includes saying (if necessary) what is not 
policy. A statement in the Style Guide saying that something "should not 
be defined by policy" is therefore completely out of place.

If there should ever be an attempt in the RSWG to define any kind of 
policy on the number of links in an RFC, I see absolutely no problem 
with somebody from the RPC contributing to that discussion and arguing 
that such a policy would be a bad idea. And I definitely would agree 
with that.

But putting anything like this in a style guide isn't appropriate. If it 
wasn't intended that way, please explain it and fix it so that it's not 
misunderstood. If there are other places in the Style Guide that contain 
similar wording, please fix them, too.

Regards,   Martin.

> Best regards,
> Jean
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> rfc-interest mailing list
> rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org
> https://mailman.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest

v2.23.0 | Report a Bug | By Email