Re: [saag] keys under doormats: is our doormat ok?

"Henry B (Hank) Hotz, CISSP" <hbhotz@oxy.edu> Mon, 20 July 2015 02:55 UTC

Return-Path: <hbhotz@oxy.edu>
X-Original-To: saag@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: saag@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E6851B2F07 for <saag@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 19 Jul 2015 19:55:19 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.2
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_05=-0.5, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1LLwqOn_ud-W for <saag@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 19 Jul 2015 19:55:17 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mailout.easymail.ca (mailout.easymail.ca [64.68.201.169]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A3A2A1B2F04 for <saag@ietf.org>; Sun, 19 Jul 2015 19:55:17 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailout.easymail.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id ADF8AE020; Sun, 19 Jul 2015 22:55:16 -0400 (EDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at mailout.easymail.ca
Received: from mailout.easymail.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (easymail-mailout.easydns.vpn [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id RkVoH5FZHzUh; Sun, 19 Jul 2015 22:55:15 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from [192.168.3.132] (71-80-163-186.static.lsan.ca.charter.com [71.80.163.186]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mailout.easymail.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3FCAADFCB; Sun, 19 Jul 2015 22:55:15 -0400 (EDT)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 8.2 \(2102\))
From: "Henry B (Hank) Hotz, CISSP" <hbhotz@oxy.edu>
In-Reply-To: <CAMm+Lwi2+ZqyfJHuTsq4PfwkzgDBxj3a1_M3vX-L1p2Rkyp=KQ@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2015 19:55:14 -0700
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message-Id: <720DCCF2-CA04-428D-86D0-852AD7505383@oxy.edu>
References: <CAMm+Lwi2+ZqyfJHuTsq4PfwkzgDBxj3a1_M3vX-L1p2Rkyp=KQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: Phillip Hallam-Baker <phill@hallambaker.com>, Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie>, "saag@ietf.org" <saag@ietf.org>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.2102)
Archived-At: <http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/saag/0RtHcmzo8ZKlf_F43hEYy1GfyNQ>
Cc: Dave Crocker <dcrocker@bbiw.net>
Subject: Re: [saag] keys under doormats: is our doormat ok?
X-BeenThere: saag@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: Security Area Advisory Group <saag.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/saag>, <mailto:saag-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/saag/>
List-Post: <mailto:saag@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:saag-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/saag>, <mailto:saag-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2015 02:55:19 -0000

My $.02 is that this all sounds like a rerun of the clipper chip debates. The only problem is that the proposal is (so far) so abstract that it can’t end as quickly.

For those who don’t remember, it was a chip to encrypt digital cell phone conversations so only the two parties and the NSA could decrypt them. It all came to an abrupt halt when a Japanese mathematician cracked and published how to access the back door. Thankfully, that was before any mandate had been imposed.

I can’t believe that even the NSA can design a system where that won’t eventually happen for anything we put out there. I can’t believe that even the NSA can design a good enough doormat.

Why are we debating this all over again?

Sorry, I realize I should send this email to my congress-critters, and not here.