Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's security guarantees
David Mandelberg <david@mandelberg.org> Wed, 09 September 2015 01:21 UTC
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Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2015 21:21:52 -0400
From: David Mandelberg <david@mandelberg.org>
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Subject: Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's security guarantees
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On 2015-09-08 21:07, Rob Austein wrote: > Hmm, I would have thought we'd want to keep the chaining, in the > sense > that non-originating would sign the previous signature. I've no real > objection to signing everything else again, it's just removal of the > previous signature that I find odd here. > > The benefit I see to keeping the signature chaining is that it adds > an > ordering constraint to the signatures (signature A must have been > created after signature B), corresponding to the order in which we > expect the update to travel between signers. This seems like a good > thing, and I don't see why we'd want to remove it. As you've > demonstrated, it doesn't remove all possible forms of mischief, but > it > raises the bar a bit, and it's cheap, so why not? I agree that signature chaining provides the guarantee you stated, that signatures were generated in order. But in the presence of non-validating signers, I don't think it provides any other guarantee. What does the guarantee about signature order provide? I don't see how it's useful, but I could be missing something. > Am I missing something? Where's the benefit in removing the > chaining? There's no benefit to removing it, except that I don't see any benefit to keeping it (if we sign the full data, as I described). -- David Eric Mandelberg / dseomn http://david.mandelberg.org/
- [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's secur… David Mandelberg
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Randy Bush
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Rob Austein
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Sriram, Kotikalapudi
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Rob Austein
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Borchert, Oliver
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Borchert, Oliver
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Sandra Murphy
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Randy Bush
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Sriram, Kotikalapudi
- [sidr] replay threats (was: draft-ietf-sidr-bgpse… Randy Bush
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Sandra Murphy
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Sriram, Kotikalapudi
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… David Mandelberg
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… David Mandelberg
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… David Mandelberg
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Rob Austein
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… David Mandelberg
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Rob Austein
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Stephen Kent
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… David Mandelberg
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Sriram, Kotikalapudi
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Randy Bush
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Sandra Murphy
- Re: [sidr] draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-protocol-13's s… Matthew Lepinski
- Re: [sidr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-pro… Sriram, Kotikalapudi
- Re: [sidr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-pro… Sandra Murphy
- Re: [sidr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-sidr-bgpsec-pro… Sriram, Kotikalapudi