Re: [Softwires] Control and data plane

My fear is that we fix in the requirements document something that is too
strict and we realize it only when working in the solution ...

Regards,
Jordi

> De: "Durand, Alain" <Alain_Durand@cable.comcast.com>
> Responder a: <alain_durand@cable.comcast.com>
> Fecha: Mon, 16 Jan 2006 12:01:47 -0500
> Para: <jordi.palet@consulintel.es>, <softwires@ietf.org>
> Conversación: [Softwires] Control and data plane
> Asunto: RE: [Softwires] Control and data plane
> 
> Jordi,
>  
> This discussion is a very good one to have when discussing the solution space.
> Note how this is related to the issue of softwire signaling: inbound or
> out-of-band with the data.
>  
>    - Alain.
> 
> ________________________________
> 
> From: softwires-bounces@ietf.org on behalf of JORDI PALET MARTINEZ
> Sent: Mon 1/16/2006 10:23 AM
> To: softwires@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [Softwires] Control and data plane
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Alain,
> 
> See below.
> 
> Regards,
> Jordi
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> De: "Durand, Alain" <Alain_Durand@cable.comcast.com>
>> Responder a: <alain_durand@cable.comcast.com>
>> Fecha: Mon, 16 Jan 2006 09:00:34 -0500
>> Para: <jordi.palet@consulintel.es>, <softwires@ietf.org>
>> Conversación: Control and data plane
>> Asunto: RE: [Softwires] Control and data plane
>> 
>>> From: softwires-bounces@ietf.org on behalf of JORDI PALET MARTINEZ
>>> Sent: Mon 1/16/2006 8:31 AM
>>> To: softwires@ietf.org
>>> Subject: [Softwires] Control and data plane
>> 
>>> 
>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> 
>>> I'm trying to clarify myself about this:
>>> 
>>> 3.11.2.  Privacy, Integrity, and Replay protection
>>> 
>>>   The softwire Control and/or Data plane MUST be able to provide full
>>>   payload security (such as IPsec or SSL) when desired.  This
>>>   additional protection MUST be separable from the tunneling aspect of
>>>   the softwire mechanism itself.  For IPsec, default profiles MUST be
>>>  defined. [draft-ietf-v6ops-ipsec-tunnels] provides guidelines on
>>>   this.
>>> 
>>> I'm starting to think that if I can't understand this text being 100% sure
>>> about what we want to say, then is not clear enough ;-)
>>> 
>>> My question is, when we say contral and/or data plane, we are referring to
>>> the softwire protocol itself including any handshaking etc. ?
>>> 
>>> So the handshaking is the payload and then is data, or data is the tunnel.
>>> 
>>> Because if data is the tunnel (which is what I think), then it is already
>>> covered by the 2nd sentence ...
>> 
>> 
>> The "control' plane is the softwire mechanism. The data plane is made of the
>> tunneled data.
> 
> Agree, that was my understanding.
> 
>> My reading of the second sentence is that there is no a-priori restriction on
>> the way this security is achieved. For example, one can decide to protect the
>> control plane
>> and not the data plane or vice versa, and this should be doable regardless of
>> the tunneling
>> control mechanism softwire will use...
>> 
>> Does this makes things clearer?
>> 
>>> Moreover, are we requiring encryption or just authentication ?
>> 
>> Both and neither.
> 
> So the choices are:
> 1) Apply encryption or authentication or both together to the data plane
> (the tunnel)
> 2) Apply encryption or authentication or both together to the control plane
> (the mechanism)
> 
> I'm sure about 1), but not sure about 2 (at least for the encryption part),
> it will enforce to use, for example, an IPsec tunnel for the softwires
> protocol, that is already tunneling some data, and may be using IPsec
> itself.
> 
> Do we really need all that ? May be we need to consider if there is a severe
> threat if not requiring encryption. Authentication seems easy to support in
> the protocol itself w/o the need to use one more tunnel (an IPsec one).
> 
> 
>> 
>>     - Alain.
>> 
>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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