[Venue-selection] Istanbul

"Ali C. Begen" <ali.begen@networked.media> Wed, 24 May 2023 10:22 UTC

Return-Path: <ali.begen@networked.media>
X-Original-To: venue-selection@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: venue-selection@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0A49C151B07 for <venue-selection@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 24 May 2023 03:22:24 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.095
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.095 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, URIBL_DBL_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, URIBL_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=networked.media
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id r7vUsZv_3Ctv for <venue-selection@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 24 May 2023 03:22:20 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-ot1-x32f.google.com (mail-ot1-x32f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::32f]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9D2E2C151098 for <venue-selection@ietf.org>; Wed, 24 May 2023 03:22:20 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-ot1-x32f.google.com with SMTP id 46e09a7af769-6af74ca9f4aso78015a34.3 for <venue-selection@ietf.org>; Wed, 24 May 2023 03:22:20 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=networked.media; s=google; t=1684923739; x=1687515739; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:mime-version:from:to:cc:subject :date:message-id:reply-to; bh=u7hDZTf8fLh7YXa4LcbRNKOP7J2kQ06eCtRMUERDltI=; b=FhKqFlR+sjZ2zLp1ZwE8BehN/DeKLMF6KXtXf/Q7B9kqdJztZdfvojoYrB0XqUg+qh WSLKxzQZxz0ufI60Y4jATPPd3P/iprR4a6gVrBT/zSGbSbs7Em+IVBV1wovJwVW37o2R DMvd9zrswq6GIpWtT04vyP7GE7VnSqJbNaNbPo9Z18z4jGHOWa+kIMBKm2DPsEvRJ3Re GFk2gIa+lzJFsE+V2s1UzMRhSQGwZVgi2Ifpz+xuYiQ5/X9qc6GI1D8Gd8zHmyMzxveq n284tVJYa0AFvf7FCwfxmOSbPfGVRvaXSnL7xkddeauqlkh1TX6HkUnDGOSFr0FSwqWg 1zUA==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20221208; t=1684923739; x=1687515739; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:mime-version:x-gm-message-state :from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=u7hDZTf8fLh7YXa4LcbRNKOP7J2kQ06eCtRMUERDltI=; b=ebZyHiYtkhDlh36A+qsmSc/HxR2eIS7Ozt7lTEFaCMGrXq9UiBBW74Sei7DxSWIYZ6 V7s0xJrv+S3bRyKE5x37dIqaobA2rZZZGyyJ+4DxcssAaJPO4+3Dq7ez5v74NtLS7hDU fHLS7MJu0St+DjLMVWOCGr5cDrwiabyQaoVFgQHk9sl2YEpFaSykTUKk0EjpnzaQommw UVpXSCwo4aAZBmxQoqHHjCzuCL6GwMRSkOAZ1BP6dKlE866ikycG9UXbZJJqR9vj6Juc bG4pJLmibPcnooph6EpgwUfakU3Yk2tLVUHdHC6onhliG6WlXMOtdktW0IMr9JT866rj +G9Q==
X-Gm-Message-State: AC+VfDyrRtY6mnYWsl9YHRCICdG1JTTn9jJe0XNYGqoJOf7UG9rP9qYF 2RfJCYojEAg4afHorTVDJ3r/2raM9/C2pw3LHyNb3TuJoEAQ7m1DExKZnQ==
X-Google-Smtp-Source: ACHHUZ5PnsaRCKUAXWjFKs5JjwQm/GVMOdC9r5WGc/Hyaafq9Y3iVCK7lTk/j3deSflobWx+tJ30hB2WMLGexUu2KmE=
X-Received: by 2002:a9d:7385:0:b0:6af:6f25:487 with SMTP id j5-20020a9d7385000000b006af6f250487mr5943202otk.6.1684923739059; Wed, 24 May 2023 03:22:19 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
From: "Ali C. Begen" <ali.begen@networked.media>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2023 13:22:07 +0300
Message-ID: <CAA4MczuuJC1naGBFtnCddzAN2eMi7ZwN+SHzTfbJ08Z8p8zgSg@mail.gmail.com>
To: venue-selection@ietf.org
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000f0cc1c05fc6de0f4"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/venue-selection/stLCPyIynv2tiLQA38kpxmuUMho>
Subject: [Venue-selection] Istanbul
X-BeenThere: venue-selection@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.39
Precedence: list
List-Id: Venue Selection <venue-selection.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/venue-selection>, <mailto:venue-selection-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/venue-selection/>
List-Post: <mailto:venue-selection@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:venue-selection-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/venue-selection>, <mailto:venue-selection-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 May 2023 10:22:24 -0000

Hi there,

As someone who moved back to Turkiye about 10 years ago, I want to provide
some input.

First, the VPN information is inaccurate. VPNs are used on a daily basis by
the public (at all ages) because of particular websites/services being
banned by the local courts temporarily or permanently. The VPN provider
websites are often blocked but there is no problem reaching the VPN servers
once an account is established through other means (like in-app purchases
or getting an account outside the country). So, I believe some revision on
this subject is required.

Second, there are (runoff) elections this weekend. Doing a general
reassessment in a few months might be reasonable (although I don't
personally expect many changes in the current government).

Section 6.1 assessment seems contradictory. The reported value is 0.693 and
the threshold is 0.7 (are these numbers this accurate?). The report says
there was no data to check whether Istanbul was any better or worse than
the country's average. That is absolutely the case (anybody who has even a
vague idea of the country would agree to this). So, rather than a red flag,
maybe you should have used an orange (or at least a gray) flag.

Section 6.3 assessment is itself a big political and public discussion
point in the country (depending on who you ask about it). I have my
opinions on this, so does everybody else. The only thing I want to say is
that anybody following common sense when speaking in public about sensitive
subjects will unlikely get into any trouble. In other words, unless someone
is deliberately looking for trouble, there won't likely be one.

One final input I can provide is that I organized a large MPEG (ISO)
meeting last month in Antalya (not Istanbul). Please have a look at the
website for participant comments (also photos and videos):
https://mpeg142.com/en/. The comments were overwhelmingly positive (despite
some initial concerns similar to the ones outlined in your report).
FWIW, you can also consider Antalya as a potential venue as it may offer
better weather, more activities and a more relaxed meeting environment
(beach, nature, etc.). In the end, both cities have excellent flight
connections, are among the world's top tourist destinations and visa is a
non-issue for many countries.

Thanks.
-acbegen