[draft 2] Minutes IETF teleconference 20070620
Philippe Le Hegaret <plh@w3.org> Fri, 22 June 2007 13:37 UTC
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From: Philippe Le Hegaret <plh@w3.org>
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Subject: [draft 2] Minutes IETF teleconference 20070620
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I incorporated the comments I received so far, so here is the latest version of the minutes: W3C/IETF coordination 20 Jun 2007 [2]Agenda [2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Team/w3c-ietf-coord/2007Jun/0009.html See also: [3]IRC log [3] http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-irc Attendees Present W3C: Thomas Roessler, Dan Connolly, Philippe Le Hégaret, Tim Berners-Lee IETF: John C Klensin, Leslie Daigle, Lisa Dusseault Regrets None Chair Thomas Scribe Philippe Contents * [4]Topics 1. [5]Convene; pick scribe; bash agenda 2. [6]Link headers; Profile 3. [7]Charmod normalization work 4. [8]XML Schema and Language Tags (Lisa) 5. [9]Progress on application/wsdl+xml and application/wspolicy+xml (Philippe) 6. [10]Content-coding/transfer-coding values for HTTP -- how to register a new one? (Philippe) 7. [11]Current state of HTTP chartering discussions (MNot) 8. [12]XML Security Specs workshop announced (tlr) 9. [13]draft-hartman-webauth-phishing-03 (Lisa) 10. [14]tools.ietf.org to the rescue re 404 Internet Drafts? 11. [15]HTML WG presence at Chicago IETF 12. [16]HTML+E-Mail: who needs to talk? 13. [17]IESG/IAB leadership changes 14. [18]Next meeting * [19]Summary of Action Items _________________________________________________________ Convene; pick scribe; bash agenda <scribe> scribe: Philippe Link headers; Profile ACTION: Mark Nottingham to talk to ATOMPUB folks about link headers [recorded in [20]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action01] ACTION: Mark Nottingham, Chris Newman and Ted Hardie to discuss adding Profile to the message header registry. [recorded in [21]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action02] Dan: last time, we were talking about community review. rel=nofollow got me interested in this. I sent mail on March 26. John: I don't recall seeing anything I can use. if you resend your message, I will follow up ACTION: Dan to resent his March 26 message to John [recorded in [22]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action03] Tim: was at the egov workshop. someone for google, talking about sidemaps, was saying that they don't believe in doing stuff through standard, they prefer to get people together. JL of Google who presented sitemaps did say they were interested in taking t it to W3C at one point. Dan: you can't use sitemaps without knowing the technology you're investing in. Charmod normalization work [DONE] ACTION: John Klensin to review charmod normalization work ongoing in the W3C; Richard Ishida is the W3C contact. [recorded in [23]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action04] John: I reviewed the document and didn't end up with questions. the ietf related work is stalled at this point so nothing really happen. [this item is closed] XML Schema and Language Tags (Lisa) Lisa: questions regarding rfc 4646 and xml schema 1.0. ... we could try to work around but nicer to fix it Philippe: schema does allow language tags from 4646 from a lexical and value space perspective so the specs compatible. That's the good news. The only problem is the reference. The second edition of XML Schema 1.0 has updated reference from 1746 to 3066. The XML Schema Working Group debated whether to add "and successors" in the second edition but rejected the idea unfortunately. The good news is that the reference has been updated in the past, so we should be able to update the reference in a future 3rd edition. The bad news is that 3rd ed isn't coming up any time soon. at least a year, probably longer ... Lisa: please relay our issue to your people Philippe: the "good news" is that we now realized that schema 1.1 doesn't refer to RFC 4646, we need to fix that ACTION: plh to pass on the RFC 4646 reference issue to XML Schema WG [recorded in [24]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action05] Progress on application/wsdl+xml and application/wspolicy+xml (Philippe) Philippe: We have a [25]W3C media type registration process. I need to send messages to IESG in order to register the media type. I did this, but I don't get feed-back and I don't what to answer when W3C Working Groups ask me for a progress report (besides "I sent the request".) Where should I look about the status of the March requests? [25] http://www.w3.org/2002/06/registering-mediatype Lisa: I don't really know about mime types. Ted used to do that in the past. Chris Newman is now replacing him. Dan: [26]IESG agenda is world readable. If we send a request and don't see it on the agenda, is it dropped? [26] http://www.ietf.org/IESG/agenda.html Lisa: I don't know exactly. would need to investigate. I'm not aware of a page that will give the status of meme registration Tim: it would be useful for the input queue to be visible. Consider this as a request from W3C to IETF. A tracking system for example. Dan: the tracking system is only for internet draft and we don't use that <JcK> Lisa, there is no reason why a MIME registration request for something requiring approval couldn't go into the main tracker, is there? Or treat it as a liaison statement? ACTION: Philippe to follow up with Chris Newman on media type registration system [recorded in [27]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action07] Content-coding/transfer-coding values for HTTP -- how to register a new one? (Philippe) Philippe: One of our groups (Efficient XML Interchange) is considering adding a content-coding/transfer-coding for HTTP. The HTTP RFC indicates that there is a registration mechanism in place but doesn't give details. what's the state of the registration system? Is there one? Are we the first to add a new value? Lisa: JSR did in past, so you're not the first one. See [28]"pack200-gzip Network Transfer Format for Java Archives [JSR200]" [28] http://www.iana.org/assignments/http-parameters Philippe: send mail to iesg? Lisa: no, there is no review list. You could copy the IESG, but IANA is the responsible party ... Dan: input queue where? Lisa: iana@iana.org John: there might be a problem in here... Dan: there's a gzip in the jsr one. these are all compression schemes?! John: content-type? content-transfer-encoding? Philippe: [29]content-coding and [30]transfer-coding. [29] http://www.w3.org/Protocols/rfc2616/rfc2616-sec3.html#sec3.5 [30] http://www.w3.org/Protocols/rfc2616/rfc2616-sec3.html#sec3.6 John: concerned about layering of packing/unpacking the argument has to do with the layering of packing and unpacking. gzip for example has a 8bits coding. Dan: transfer-coding — is this the same as MIME content-transfer-encoding John: if it isn't MIME coding, then it's not a problem Dan: http, not mime Philippe: not talking about mime John: ok, sorry for confusing Current state of HTTP chartering discussions (MNot) [Mark isn't around unfortunately.] Lisa: the BOF was approved. it's on the [31]draft ietf agenda. I asked Mark to send out a wide announcement. the charter discussion are ongoing on the w3c hosted mailing list. the charter is in no way finished and will change a lot [31] https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/meeting_agenda_html.cgi?meeting_num=69 Philippe: no comment right now. Yves is tracking. Dan: will he be there? Philippe: will make sure he goes Thomas: I'll also be there Philippe: I will talk to Yves XML Security Specs workshop announced (tlr) Thomas: we have issued a [32]call for participation in a workshop on xml signature and xml encryption suites of specifications next steps. 25/26 September 2007 — Mountain View, California. only requirement is to have a position paper. not limited to working group participants. will be happy to brief at the security area in chicago [32] http://www.w3.org/2007/xmlsec/ws/cfp lisa: also the application area open meeting ACTION: Thomas to send email to Sam Hartman regarding the W3C security workshop cfp [recorded in [33]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action08] draft-hartman-webauth-phishing-03 (Lisa) Lisa: I'm the sponsor for this draft. sollicited a number of experts reviews. new reviews would be timely. it talks about uri. ACTION: Thomas to solicit review from the Web Security Context WG [recorded in [34]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action09] LIsa: it's finishing last call now. could wait a couple of weeks. I might allow longer time if there are more changes required tools.ietf.org to the rescue re 404 Internet Drafts? <DanC> is the "let's not talk about the IETF secretariat" ban still in place? I see various tools.ietf.org deelies that suggest that Internet Drafts don't need to go 404 any more Dan: internet drafts that go 404. cost time to recover from. last time, there were changes in the secretariat and it wasn't the right time to bring the issue. Is now ok? ISOC maintains nice URIs: [35]http://ietfreport.isoc.org/idref/draft-ietf-atompub-format/ [35] http://ietfreport.isoc.org/idref/draft-ietf-atompub-format/ Lisa: the uri announced will still change. Leslie: it won't go away until the IETF process change Dan: which part of the process say that I will change the uri and won't give clue of the new version such as "this looks out of date, you might want to use this other link instead" John: we've got a database of IDs and the entries are linked to the latest version Tim: but you don't keep the URI as a pointer John: yes, it disappears after 6 months Lisa: could be an entrance to the latest version Thomas: ... or to tracker <DanC> [36]progress on ietf.org persistence, structured archive [36] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ietf-w3c/2005Aug/0000.html Leslie: what I heard is that we should give a pointer to the latest document after 6 months. The IETF Administrative Director (IAD), Ray Pelletier, seems the right individual to contact for that. <knitbot> E.g., if you have [37]http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-iab-net-transparent-04 .txt, you have no clue that [38]http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-iab-net-transparent-05 .txt is real [37] http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-iab-net-transparent-04.txt [38] http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-iab-net-transparent-05.txt Dan: I'd like something like "you dialed the wrong number, the new number is ..." Tim: if you can return 302 or 301, this would be even better. Leslie: people have scripts that will rely on 404. the point is well taken but it is an administrative discussion, nothing philosophical. Lisa: would be useful to send an email to IAD ACTION: Dan to follow up with Ray Pelletier on 404 for RFCs keeping Leslie and Lisa in the loop [recorded in [39]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action10] HTML WG presence at Chicago IETF Dan: W3C created a new HTML working group. [40]somebody asked it to be presented in Chicago. I won't be there. Should we make sure to present it? what does the IETF wnat to know. we have 485 members in the group [40] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2007JanMar/0335.html Lisa: there might some people interested. Mark Nottingham would be the guy to figure if an announcement is needed or not Dan: I'll follow up with him then ACTION: Dan to follow up with Mark Nottingham about announcing the HTML Working Group in Chicago [recorded in [41]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action11] HTML+E-Mail: who needs to talk? Thomas: we had a workshop back in May but Karl Dubost is in Japan, unable to attend here. John is concerned about it Dan: Chris Lilley briefed me about the [42]workshop. extensive tail of wow from people trying to send html to large crowds. "Can't use CSS", etc. there is a knowledge of what one can or cannot do when sending HTML [42] http://www.w3.org/2007/05/html-mail/ John: my only concern is that I don't want to be surprised on either side. many people want to make things happen. Dan: don't have sense of what's going forward. Thomas: possible team submission in september? the most useful next step is an email exchange between John and Karl, with Dan in the loop Dan: add Chris Lilley and Daniel Glazman John: and Chris Newman. the ietf email community seems concerned. Thomas: possibly about the [43]"Email security and client development - Chris Newman, Sun Microsystems" position paper [43] http://www.w3.org/2007/05/html-mail/html-email-security <DanC> [44]Workshop Papers List [44] http://www.w3.org/2007/05/html-mail/papers John: there hasn't been any response Dan: mail message or position paper? John: I noticed a [45]mail message [45] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-mail/2007May/0002.html Dan: I can ask the workshop chairs if their level of responses was unusual ACTION: Dan to contact the workshop chairs and bring back a possible follow-up plan [recorded in [46]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action12] IESG/IAB leadership changes Leslie: recent changes: Ted Hardie finished his term as application area director and was replaced by Chris Newman. Changed of chair of IAB (from Leslie to Olaf Kolkman). New IETF/IESG Chair as well: Russ Housley. Dan: who should we add/remove from the mailing list? (I don't think the IETF chair has been subscribed before) Leslie: there has been an action to review the subscriptions, not sure if they need to be on the list. I'm still on the IAB ACTION: Leslie to check with Olaf and Chris whether they will attend or not in the future [recorded in [47]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action13] Thomas: future agenda need to have more explicit attendance expectation Next meeting Next chair: Lisa <DanC> (IETF meets 3 times a year, which suggests looking 4 months forward...) Lisa: IETF meeting in December 2-7. Tentative: October 23, 2007. 10AM ET, 7AM PT <DanC> [48]Sydney and Boston times on 23 Oct [48] http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/meetingtime.html?month=10&day=23&year=2007&p1=240&p2=43&p3=-1&p4=-1 <DanC> OK for me: October 23, 2007. 10AM ET Dan: it's convenient to hear about the call at t-7 and t-1 day btw [adjourned] Summary of Action Items [PENDING] ACTION: Mark Nottingham to talk to ATOMPUB folks about link headers [recorded in [49]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action01] [PENDING] ACTION: Mark Nottingham, Chris Newman and Ted Hardie to discuss adding Profile to the message header registry. [recorded in [50]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action02] [NEW] ACTION: Dan to contact the W3C e-mail workshop chairs and bring back a possible follow-up plan on Chris Newman security message [recorded in [51]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action12] [NEW] ACTION: Dan to follow up with Mark Nottingham about announcing the HTML Working Group in Chicago [recorded in [52]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action11] [NEW] ACTION: Dan to follow up with Ray Pelletier on 404 for RFCs keeping Leslie and Lisa in the loop [recorded in [53]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action10] [NEW] ACTION: Leslie to check with Olaf and Chris whether they will attend or not in the future [recorded in [54]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action13] [NEW] ACTION: Philippe to follow up with Chris Newman on media registration system [recorded in [55]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action07] [NEW] ACTION: Philippe to bring the issue of RFC 4646 to the XML Schema Working Group [recorded in [56]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action06] [NEW] ACTION: Thomas to send email to Sam Hartman regarding the W3C security workshop cfp [recorded in [57]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action08] [NEW] ACTION: Thomas to solicit review of draft-hartman-webauth-phishing-03 from the Web Security Context WG [recorded in [58]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action09] [DONE] ACTION: Dan to resent his March 26 message to John [recorded in [59]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action03] [DONE] ACTION: John Klensin to review charmod normalization work [recorded in [60]http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-ietf-minutes.html#action04] _________________________________________________________
- Minutes IETF teleconference 20070620 Philippe Le Hegaret
- Re: Minutes IETF teleconference 20070620 Leslie Daigle
- [draft 2] Minutes IETF teleconference 20070620 Philippe Le Hegaret
- FYI: Minutes IETF teleconference 20070620 Philippe Le Hegaret