Re: [Anima-bootstrap] anima-bootstrap: Bootstrap proxy discovery options

["Michael Behringer (mbehring)" <[e-mail]>]

> >>> Or, are you arguing that the new device should initiate the
> >>> bootstrapping; but do so in a way that does not expose it is a new
> >>> device?
> >>
> >> For non-challenged (IoT) devices on non-challenged networks, the new
> >> device should initiate and drive the bootstrapping.
> >>
> >> It would be best if this communication was indistinguishable from
> >> other ACP communication to an outsider.
> >
> > This can only occur if bootstrapping is over a “provisional” ACP. I’m
> uncomfortable with having GRASP and ACP include special cases for
> bootstrapping. My gut feel is that the simplicity of a specific bootstrapping
> sequence — even if identifiable — is preferable.
> >
> > A *non-privacy* preserving bootstrapping is preferable from a certain
> point of view. I want my autonomic network to track and identify any
> overlapping autonomic bootstrapping to domains I don’t recognize.
> 
> I *really* don't see how the first step can be anything other than a
> recognizable unencrypted multicast probe, whether it is sent by the joiner or
> by some node that is already trusted. You could require that the
> unencrypted probe includes a public key so that a unicast response can be
> encrypted; but neither end is authenticated at that stage.

I agree with Brian. New node and proxy need find each other, this invariably will involve some mcast probe. And, mcr, I think also your IKE proposal included IKE mcast packets initially, right? So also that is not "normal" and will be detected. I think trying to hide the process is impossible, thus we shouldn't even try to optimise toward it, but focus on minimising disclosure. 

I think the optimum is: 
- if the proxy sends out minimal information. Probably just something identifying a domain. I don't see another way right now than doing this periodically. 
- if the new node sends nothing at all (ie just responds)

Michael