Re: [AVTCORE] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC3550 (4192)
Magnus Westerlund <magnus.westerlund@ericsson.com> Mon, 26 January 2015 12:23 UTC
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Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2015 13:22:54 +0100
From: Magnus Westerlund <magnus.westerlund@ericsson.com>
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To: Julius Friedman <juliusfriedman@gmail.com>, Roni Even <ron.even.tlv@gmail.com>, avt@ietf.org
References: <20141204014737.6282D181CD3@rfc-editor.org> <038501d01a0c$93470820$b9d51860$@gmail.com> <CACFvNHWWUGTPLkQuv=6NJuzptA6kNa504JexGOnfL6cqLL7YXQ@mail.gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [AVTCORE] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC3550 (4192)
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Hi Julius On 2014-12-17 16:36, Julius Friedman wrote: > So quite simply how can jitter and transit use the absolute time from > packet to packet but yet the calculation of payload data rate is using > the same? > > Wouldn't time spent on non data items be used then? I don't quite understand you here. But, I guess that you are complaining about that the measured entity is not the most relevant. However, this is not at all reason enough to make a change to the RTCP report block specification in RFC 3550. As noted before, using Errata is not the appropriate method for technical change. Errata is used to flag significant issues, or clarify text that might be misinterpret to avoid incompatibility issue. > > What about the security concerns related to congruence? If I understand the security concern correctly. This is that in case one uses padded payloads in the protection operation, this report leaks the summary over the amount of new payload bytes received between each report, potentially for a single packet. Thus providing an information leak that might provide some insight into the protected data. For example the audio frame lengths from a variable rate codec. In would agree that this would be worth taking note of as a security issue. Potentially change the design to avoid it. However, I would first of all note that this RTCP definition has been in place since 1996. It is very widely deployed and any change to it would result in incompatibilities. Further it is clearly possible to protected against. Simply encrypt the RTCP also. Which would be my recommendation anyway if one encrypts the RTP packets. > > How is that not errata unless these invalid calculations and security > issues were intentionally mandated and why now would I knowing these > things continue to do things as usual? First of all it is a technical change that is non-backwards compatible. It does not represent clarifying the WG consensus on how it should be done. > > Furthermore can you simply tell me what breaks if I use the octets > indicated as I indicated (by only not accounting for the 12 octet header)? Any implementation that tracks these values would flag an inconsistency and possible cease transmission. Because your receiver will claim to have received more bytes than the sending party has sent according to its calculation of this value. > > WITH ALL DUE RESPECT That should be the determining factor not your > opinions about intentions. Please understand a few things. There are process that exist. There are purposes and rules for what is allowed to be done with difference processed and mechanisms. In addition there are considerations of the impact of any changes to existing specifications. Which in its turn leads back to the process question. Roni, in his role a WG co-chair has the responsibility for driving these processes. One of these is to determine the WG's recommendation to the AD for how an errata is to be handled. > > My tests reveal faster synchronization with rtcp with legacy clients as > well as a correct rate and data rate when then is calculated by removing > the csrc extension and padding. Sorry, I don't understand how you get faster synchronization. This should have no effect on the RTCP packet transmission rules and their execution. > > How about some calculations and tests are also performed to validate > this as most default profiles don't use any of the items in question > anyway. > > Additionally why has nothing been said about rfc2326 and errata 4199? > RFC 2326 is an MMUSIC item. Please, keep the topics separated and with clear subject lines. Please avoid cross posting between the WG mailing lists. Can you please refrain from creating more erratas until you have achieved some WG consensus that any issue is requiring an errata and what the new text should actually be. Cheers Magnus Westerlund ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Services, Media and Network features, Ericsson Research EAB/TXM ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Ericsson AB | Phone +46 10 7148287 Färögatan 6 | Mobile +46 73 0949079 SE-164 80 Stockholm, Sweden | mailto: magnus.westerlund@ericsson.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------
- [AVTCORE] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC3550 (41… RFC Errata System
- Re: [AVTCORE] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC3550… Julius Friedman
- [AVTCORE] Fwd: Re: [Technical Errata Reported] RF… Julius Friedman
- Re: [AVTCORE] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC3550… Stephen Casner
- Re: [AVTCORE] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC3550… Frederick, Ron
- Re: [AVTCORE] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC3550… Julius Friedman
- Re: [AVTCORE] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC3550… Roni Even
- Re: [AVTCORE] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC3550… Magnus Westerlund
- Re: [AVTCORE] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC3550… Magnus Westerlund
- Re: [AVTCORE] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC3550… Magnus Westerlund
- [AVTCORE] [Errata Rejected] RFC3550 (4192) RFC Errata System