Re: [Coin] Academic contributions in COIN

Frank Fitzek <frank.fitzek@tu-dresden.de> Wed, 09 October 2019 13:29 UTC

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To: coin@irtf.org, Hani Salah <hani.salah@tu-dresden.de>
References: <CAPjWiCTXJdkNWAMLhgv2Pb70gxX5=J0oXH8kyw4EfC4NF-B+PA@mail.gmail.com> <CAJi8f4EF-pEzkWkpQSsOESF84kzVH-U82JrSZJ2BcOPK3TDv0A@mail.gmail.com> <dd6aa8da8c9842ceb0ba9c02ed048e11@fortiss.org> <CAPjWiCRjtpqAG_Ypg7gwK1GwYPftit9+d0QBrNE-wgcWretm1A@mail.gmail.com> <993389b4904f49efb929fc83889b583f@fortiss.org> <CAPjWiCT_1LeYY+W-CGVHTUaMG3Q=1Tqc42ZDScteNsjdiKZc_g@mail.gmail.com> <9fbe48c2c2484fd78d3f8aff1c67b8d8@fortiss.org> <CAPjWiCQPZCgqT_fQLOEG4-pPdCWD63J+OiShP_W8UJqA15YrBA@mail.gmail.com> <bee0830552af40d39b7effab3c508181@fortiss.org> <CAPjWiCSDBH4D3PQtAYs-_3Te1qs3dTXcUFyMbMgvE-XTU3Jtmg@mail.gmail.com>
From: Frank Fitzek <frank.fitzek@tu-dresden.de>
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Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2019 15:28:55 +0200
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Subject: Re: [Coin] Academic contributions in COIN
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Regarding the emulator, my colleague Hani will subscribe to the list and 
share the link with more details. The emulator comes with examples and 
can be used for tutorials if needed.

FF

On 09.10.2019 15:23, Marie-Jose Montpetit wrote:
> And we should all help!
>
> Marie-José Montpetit, Ph.D.
> Research Affiliate, MIT Media Laboratory
> mariejose@mjmontpetit.com <mailto:mariejose@mjmontpetit.com>
> mariejo@mit.edu <mailto:mariejo@mit.edu>
>
> On October 9, 2019 at 9:22:11 AM, Rute Sofia (sofia@fortiss.org 
> <mailto:sofia@fortiss.org>) wrote:
>
>> Well,
>>
>> indeed that has to be made clearer to students and to teachers…
>>
>> BR
>>
>> Rute
>>
>> *From:*Coin <coin-bounces@irtf.org <mailto:coin-bounces@irtf.org>> 
>> *On Behalf Of *Marie-Jose Montpetit
>> *Sent:* 09 October 2019 15:21
>> *To:* Rute Sofia <sofia@fortiss.org <mailto:sofia@fortiss.org>>; Noa 
>> Zilberman <noa.zilberman@cl.cam.ac.uk 
>> <mailto:noa.zilberman@cl.cam.ac.uk>>
>> *Cc:* coinrg-chairs@irtf.org <mailto:coinrg-chairs@irtf.org>; 
>> coin@irtf.org <mailto:coin@irtf.org>
>> *Subject:* Re: [Coin] Academic contributions in COIN
>>
>> This is why we have to make sure we do not put IRTF and IETF in the 
>> same sentence…
>>
>> Again, IRTF is not standardisation more like a forum to share 
>> research on common networking topics. The fact we meet at the IETF 
>> locations is for convenience and it was mentioned earlier this month 
>> on a chairs mailing list that it is not mandatory.
>>
>> And you can participate remotely for free and we had a number of 
>> contributions that way in the past years.
>>
>> Marie-José Montpetit, Ph.D.
>>
>> Research Affiliate, MIT Media Laboratory
>>
>> mariejose@mjmontpetit.com <mailto:mariejose@mjmontpetit.com>
>>
>> mariejo@mit.edu <mailto:mariejo@mit.edu>
>>
>> On October 9, 2019 at 9:12:30 AM, Rute Sofia (sofia@fortiss.org 
>> <mailto:sofia@fortiss.org>) wrote:
>>
>>     Dear Marie-Jose Montpetit,
>>
>>     there is a reason for that. Standards are not usually, at least
>>     in Europe, considered valid success indicators from an
>>     academic/scientific perspective. Classes on research
>>     methodologies do not usually approach standardisation, even if
>>     oriented towards research. That is why a lot of students (IMO,
>>     from my own academic experience in several countries) don’t
>>     follow the IRTF/IETF.
>>
>>     Additionally, participation in the IRTF/IETF requires travelling,
>>     which is costly. Academic institutions and projects do not
>>     (usually ) foresee this. In fact, in European projects the
>>     standardisation is actually left to the industry partners.. No
>>     funding, no reason to participate J
>>
>>     This is slowly changing.
>>
>>     Tutorials, and organization of workshops co-located to scientific
>>     events, is a fast way to attract students. After all, most
>>     conferences today have a PhD forum…I agree also with the other
>>     measures being proposed…
>>
>>     BR
>>
>>     Rute
>>
>>     *From:*Marie-Jose Montpetit <marie@mjmontpetit.com
>>     <mailto:marie@mjmontpetit.com>>
>>     *Sent:* 09 October 2019 13:10
>>     *To:* Rute Sofia <sofia@fortiss.org <mailto:sofia@fortiss.org>>;
>>     Noa Zilberman <noa.zilberman@cl.cam.ac.uk
>>     <mailto:noa.zilberman@cl.cam.ac.uk>>
>>     *Cc:* coinrg-chairs@irtf.org <mailto:coinrg-chairs@irtf.org>;
>>     coin@irtf.org <mailto:coin@irtf.org>
>>     *Subject:* RE: [Coin] Academic contributions in COIN
>>
>>     I also did both and still do. But if professors are not
>>     interested students will not either. So we have to work all angles.
>>
>>     Marie-José Montpetit, Ph.D.
>>
>>     Research Affiliate, MIT Media Laboratory
>>
>>     mariejose@mjmontpetit.com <mailto:mariejose@mjmontpetit.com>
>>
>>     mariejo@mit.edu <mailto:mariejo@mit.edu>
>>
>>     On October 9, 2019 at 7:02:00 AM, Rute Sofia (sofia@fortiss.org
>>     <mailto:sofia@fortiss.org>) wrote:
>>
>>         Well,
>>
>>         it is for students. I am in both worlds (academia and
>>         research towards industry) so… J
>>
>>         Rute
>>
>>         *From:*Marie-Jose Montpetit <marie@mjmontpetit.com
>>         <mailto:marie@mjmontpetit.com>>
>>         *Sent:* 09 October 2019 12:42
>>         *To:* Rute Sofia <sofia@fortiss.org
>>         <mailto:sofia@fortiss.org>>; Noa Zilberman
>>         <noa.zilberman@cl.cam.ac.uk <mailto:noa.zilberman@cl.cam.ac.uk>>
>>         *Cc:* coinrg-chairs@irtf.org <mailto:coinrg-chairs@irtf.org>;
>>         coin@irtf.org <mailto:coin@irtf.org>
>>         *Subject:* RE: [Coin] Academic contributions in COIN
>>
>>         But that is the point: IRTF is NOT standardisation.
>>
>>         But OK for tutorials it seems its needed :)
>>
>>         mjm
>>
>>         Marie-José Montpetit, Ph.D.
>>
>>         Research Affiliate, MIT Media Laboratory
>>
>>         mariejose@mjmontpetit.com <mailto:mariejose@mjmontpetit.com>
>>
>>         mariejo@mit.edu <mailto:mariejo@mit.edu>
>>
>>         On October 9, 2019 at 4:38:21 AM, Rute Sofia
>>         (sofia@fortiss.org <mailto:sofia@fortiss.org>) wrote:
>>
>>             Hello,
>>
>>             I would also suggest considering organizing tutorials and
>>             workshops co-located with relevant scientific events. IMO
>>             most students are not directed to standardisation.
>>             Therefore, most of them usually do not work towards the
>>             IETF/IRTF.
>>
>>             So to attract academia, one of the best intruments are
>>             scientific events.
>>
>>             BR
>>
>>             Rute Sofia
>>
>>             *From:*Coin <coin-bounces@irtf.org
>>             <mailto:coin-bounces@irtf.org>> *On Behalf Of *Noa Zilberman
>>             *Sent:* 08 October 2019 20:01
>>             *To:* Marie-Jose Montpetit <marie@mjmontpetit.com
>>             <mailto:marie@mjmontpetit.com>>
>>             *Cc:* coinrg-chairs@irtf.org
>>             <mailto:coinrg-chairs@irtf.org>; coin@irtf.org
>>             <mailto:coin@irtf.org>
>>             *Subject:* Re: [Coin] Academic contributions in COIN
>>
>>             Hi,
>>
>>             I would suggest that we need to find ways to incentivize
>>             academics to engage with COIN.
>>
>>             Some ideas that I can think of are:
>>
>>             1. Clearly list challenges on the wiki. These may be
>>             accompanied by drafts, but not necessarily, and can be
>>             something that was discussed on the mailing list,
>>
>>              a presentation from a meeting etc. Ideally those will be
>>             accompanied by one or two lines to describe the challenge
>>             (+pointers). This helps not only to identify gaps, but
>>             also if there's a graduate student looking for a project
>>             in in-network computing, there may be a "go to page"
>>             hosted by COINRG with potential research challenges, and
>>             potential collaborators.
>>
>>             2. Invite postdocs and students to talk at the meetings.
>>             They are usually the first authors of papers so they know
>>             the tech side well, are more likely to have the time to
>>             travel, and are eager to discuss their research.
>>
>>             3. Make data available (this was briefly mentioned in the
>>             meeting). These may be use cases, datasets, traces etc. 
>>             Research is better if it is driven by real world data
>>             (and more likely to get published).
>>
>>             4. List collaboration opportunities, internships etc that
>>             fall within COINRG domain.
>>
>>             Kind Regards,
>>
>>             Noa
>>
>>             On Tue, Oct 8, 2019 at 4:55 PM Marie-Jose Montpetit
>>             <marie@mjmontpetit.com <mailto:marie@mjmontpetit.com>> wrote:
>>
>>                 Today at the Interim Noa Zilberman raised the issue
>>                 on how to help academics contribute to COIN (thanks
>>                 Noa!).
>>
>>                 Obviously drafts are not the right vehicle for most
>>                 academics and Colin Perkins added that we could have
>>                 other mechanisms.
>>
>>                 Some inputs:
>>
>>                 - academic presentations at the meeting with
>>                 appropriate papers stored in the Github and
>>                 datatracker (we already have done some of this)
>>
>>                 - if a topic could lead to a RFC support academic
>>                 collaborators in writing a draft
>>
>>                 - keeping a list of related conferences and try to
>>                 have mini-PRG meetings there
>>
>>                 But I am sure there is much more. So what are the
>>                 list’s ideas?
>>
>>                 The minutes of the meeting will be issued and I have
>>                 a recording I will upload to the GitHub.
>>
>>                 Thanks all!
>>
>>                 mjm
>>
>>                 Marie-José Montpetit, Ph.D.
>>
>>                 Research Affiliate, MIT Media Laboratory
>>
>>                 mariejose@mjmontpetit.com
>>                 <mailto:mariejose@mjmontpetit.com>
>>
>>                 mariejo@mit...edu <mailto:mariejo@mit.edu>
>>
>>                 -- 
>>                 Coin mailing list
>>                 Coin@irtf.org <mailto:Coin@irtf.org>
>>                 https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/coin
>>
>
-- 

Frank H.P. Fitzek
Professor
Deutsche Telekom Chair of Communication Networks
Institute of Communication Technology
Technische Universität Dresden

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