Re: [Detnet] Opsdir telechat review of draft-ietf-detnet-ip-oam-12

[Greg Mirsky <[e-mail]>]

Hi Yingzhen,
thank you for your thoughtful suggestions that helped alot in improving the
document. I like shorter sentences; they make text clearer. Both text
updates accepted and are in the working version (attached).

Best regards,
Greg

On Wed, Feb 14, 2024 at 8:39 AM Yingzhen Qu <[e-mail]> wrote:

> Hi Greg,
>
> Thanks for the reply. Please see my answers below inline.
>
> Thanks,
> Yingzhen
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 13, 2024 at 9:48 PM Greg Mirsky <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>> Hi Yingzhen,
>> thank you for your kind words in support of this work; much appreciated.
>> Please find my notes below tagged GIM>>.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Greg
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 13, 2024 at 8:09 PM Yingzhen Qu via Datatracker <
>> [e-mail]> wrote:
>>
>>> Reviewer: Yingzhen Qu
>>> Review result: Ready
>>>
>>> I've reviewed version 10, and this is a follow up review.
>>>
>>> Thanks to the authors for working on this document and addressing my
>>> comments.
>>>
>>> The document readability has improved a lot from my last review of
>>> version -10,
>>> and I believe it is ready for publication.
>>>
>>> There are a couple of nits for the authors to consider.
>>>
>>> The line numbers are generated using idnits.
>>>
>>> 160        is being done by using the Internet Control Message Protocol
>>> (ICMP)
>>>
>>> nits: there should be a "." in the end.
>>>
>> GIM>> It seems like the long sentence may confuse a reader:
>>    Most of on-demand failure detection and localization in IP networks
>>    is being done by using the Internet Control Message Protocol (ICMP)
>>    Echo Request, Echo Reply and the set of defined error messages, e.g.,
>>    Destination Unreachable, with the more detailed information provided
>>    through code points.
>> The intention is to note that Echo Request/Reply that are the mechanism
>> used in ICMP are the common method for on-demand failure detection and
>> localization, i.e., of ping and traceroute. Would a slight re-wording make
>> it clearer:
>> NEW TEXT:
>>    Most of on-demand failure detection and localization in IP networks
>>    is being done by using the Internet Control Message Protocol's (ICMP)
>>    Echo Request, Echo Reply, and the set of defined error messages, e.g.,
>>    Destination Unreachable, with the more detailed information provided
>>    through code points.
>> WDYT?
>>
>
> [Yingzhen]: Now I see I did break the long sentence wrong. Fortunately the
> message of the sentence was still delivered correctly. Here is my
> suggestion:
> In IP networks, the majority of on-demand failure detection and
> localization is achieved through the use of the Internet Control Message
> Protocol (ICMP), utilizing Echo Request and Echo Reply messages, along with
> a set of defined error messages such as Destination Unreachable, which
> provide detailed information through assigned code points.
>
>
>>> 166        traffic between DetNet nodes with IP DetNet traffic, e.g.,
>>> ensure
>>> 167        that such ICMP traffic uses the DetNet IP data plane in each
>>> node,
>>>
>>> nits: somehow this sentence doesn't read well to me. "uses the DetNet IP
>>> data plane" is not very clear to me, I think you're trying to say ICMP
>>> traffic
>>> should go through the same path/interface as DetNet traffic, for example,
>>> there is ECMP between two DetNet nodes.
>>>
>> GIM>> Thank you for pointing this to me. You are correct, the intention
>> is to stress the importance of ensuring that ICMP packets traverse the same
>> set of nodes and interfaces and receieve the same QoS treatment as the
>> monitored DetNet IP flow. I propose the following update:
>> OLD TEXT:
>>    In order to use ICMP for these
>>    purposes with DetNet, DetNet nodes must be able to associate ICMP
>>    traffic between DetNet nodes with IP DetNet traffic, e.g., ensure
>>    that such ICMP traffic uses the DetNet IP data plane in each node,
>>    otherwise ICMP may be unable to detect and localize failures that are
>>    specific to the DetNet IP data plane.
>>  NEW TEXT:
>>    In order to use ICMP
>>    for these purposes with DetNet, DetNet nodes must be able to
>>    associate ICMP traffic between DetNet nodes with IP DetNet traffic,
>>    i.e., ensure that such ICMP traffic traverses the same interfaces and
>>    receives the same QoS treatment as the monitored DetNet IP flow;
>>    otherwise, ICMP may be unable to detect and localize failures that
>>    are specific to the DetNet IP data plane.
>> What are your thoughts? Is the text more clear now?
>>
>
> [Yingzhen]:  The new text is definitely more clear. Here is my suggestion,
> and it's up to you to decide whether to use it or not.
> To utilize ICMP effectively for these purposes within DetNet, DetNet nodes
> must establish the association of ICMP traffic between DetNet nodes with IP
> DetNet traffic. This entails ensuring that such ICMP traffic traverses the
> same interfaces and receives identical QoS treatment as the monitored
> DetNet IP flow. Failure to do so may result in ICMP being unable to detect
> and localize failures specific to the DetNet IP data plane.
>