Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-dnsop-serve-stale
Robert Edmonds <edmonds@mycre.ws> Fri, 08 September 2017 19:53 UTC
Return-Path: <edmonds@mycre.ws>
X-Original-To: dnsop@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: dnsop@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF4DA124205 for <dnsop@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 8 Sep 2017 12:53:18 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.901
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XL7H-KERpoc0 for <dnsop@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 8 Sep 2017 12:53:17 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mycre.ws (mycre.ws [45.33.102.105]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5B9D01204DA for <dnsop@ietf.org>; Fri, 8 Sep 2017 12:53:17 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by chase.mycre.ws (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 7B18212C0F9E; Fri, 8 Sep 2017 15:53:16 -0400 (EDT)
Date: Fri, 08 Sep 2017 15:53:16 -0400
From: Robert Edmonds <edmonds@mycre.ws>
To: tjw ietf <tjw.ietf@gmail.com>, dnsop <dnsop@ietf.org>
Message-ID: <20170908195316.ncphh3ru5v7f233g@mycre.ws>
References: <CADyWQ+FHDHcmq-mr0BCHS5A8yvaOQmhTjve1_DmZN6vAc=BKyA@mail.gmail.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Disposition: inline
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
In-Reply-To: <CADyWQ+FHDHcmq-mr0BCHS5A8yvaOQmhTjve1_DmZN6vAc=BKyA@mail.gmail.com>
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/dnsop/4escQnq7BvdikIJz0rrXCf5zDkc>
Subject: Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-dnsop-serve-stale
X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list <dnsop.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/dnsop>, <mailto:dnsop-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/dnsop/>
List-Post: <mailto:dnsop@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dnsop-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop>, <mailto:dnsop-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Sep 2017 19:53:19 -0000
tjw ietf wrote: > August is over and my self-imposed holiday is over, so it's time to get > busy again. We have this document marked as a candidate for adoption. > > This starts a formal Call for Adoption for draft-tale-dnsop-serve-stale > > The draft is available here: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tale-dnsop-serve-stale/ > > Please review this draft to see if you think it is suitable for adoption by > DNSOP, and comments to the list, clearly stating your view. > > Please also indicate if you are willing to contribute text, review, etc. > > *If You have already stated your position for or against adoption, we are > counting those so you do not need to repeat yourself. * > > This call for adoption ends: 19 September 2017 > > Thanks, > tim wicinski > DNSOP co-chair Hi, I support the adoption of this document. Comments: This document is marked as updating 1034 and 1035 but it's not clear what text from those documents is being updated. E.g. compare to "NXDOMAIN: There Really Is Nothing Underneath" (RFC 8020) which explicitly documents its revisions in its Section 3. I think the claim in the introduction, "Notably, the original DNS specification does not say that data past its expiration cannot be used" should either be justified further or removed. The "should again be consulted" text from STD 13 could be read in isolation as permitting serve stale, but it's the weakest text out of these three TTL definitions given in STD 13: RFC 1034 §3.6: "The TTL describes how long a RR can be cached before it should be discarded. […] The meaning of the TTL field is a time limit on how long an RR can be kept in a cache." RFC 1035 §3.2.1: "a 32 bit […] integer that specifies the time interval that the resource record may be cached before the source of the information should again be consulted." RFC 1035 §4.1.3: "a 32 bit […] integer that specifies the time interval (in seconds) that the resource record may be cached before it should be discarded." That is, if "the original DNS specification does not say that data past its expiration cannot be used" is true, then this document doesn't need to update STD 13, and maybe it should only be an informational document. But if it's not true (and I don't think it is, based on the other two TTL definitions in STD 13), then a new TTL definition should be given that permits the serve stale mechanism. Also, just for fun, this text from RFC 882 exists (p.28 "Resolvers with cache management") and is even stronger than the text in STD 13: "When a resolver caches a returned resource record it must also remember the TTL field. The resolver must discard the record when the equivalent amount of time has passed." -- Robert Edmonds
- [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-dnso… tjw ietf
- [DNSOP] 答复: DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Davey Song (宋林健)
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Jared Mauch
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Barry Raveendran Greene
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Vladimír Čunát
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Stephane Bortzmeyer
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Paul Vixie
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Wes Hardaker
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Joe Abley
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Paul Wouters
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Vladimír Čunát
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… 神明達哉
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Paul Vixie
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Paul Vixie
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… George Michaelson
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Jared Mauch
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Mark Andrews
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Stephane Bortzmeyer
- [DNSOP] 答复: DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Davey Song (宋林健)
- Re: [DNSOP] 答复: DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-t… Vladimír Čunát
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Tony Finch
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Paul Wouters
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Tony Finch
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Robert Edmonds
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… 神明達哉
- Re: [DNSOP] 答复: DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-t… Lanlan Pan
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Bob Harold
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… Marek Vavruša
- Re: [DNSOP] DNSOP Call for Adoption - draft-tale-… tjw ietf