Re: [Dtls-iot] dice wg future work... or time to declare victory?

"Kumar, Sandeep" <sandeep.kumar@philips.com> Mon, 26 October 2015 12:55 UTC

Return-Path: <sandeep.kumar@philips.com>
X-Original-To: dtls-iot@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: dtls-iot@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A3071B2E2F for <dtls-iot@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 26 Oct 2015 05:55:44 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: 0.799
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.799 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.8, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id awTXLN_sX9Wn for <dtls-iot@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 26 Oct 2015 05:55:41 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from emea01-db3-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-db3on0741.outbound.protection.outlook.com [IPv6:2a01:111:f400:fe04::741]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B0C431B2E2C for <dtls-iot@ietf.org>; Mon, 26 Oct 2015 05:55:40 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from DB4PR04CA0024.eurprd04.prod.outlook.com (10.160.41.34) by DBXPR04MB223.eurprd04.prod.outlook.com (10.242.140.148) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.306.13; Mon, 26 Oct 2015 12:55:34 +0000
Received: from AM1FFO11FD026.protection.gbl (2a01:111:f400:7e00::106) by DB4PR04CA0024.outlook.office365.com (2a01:111:e400:9852::34) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.306.13 via Frontend Transport; Mon, 26 Oct 2015 12:55:34 +0000
Authentication-Results: spf=none (sender IP is 23.103.247.180) smtp.mailfrom=philips.com; live.com; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;live.com; dmarc=none action=none header.from=philips.com;
Received-SPF: None (protection.outlook.com: philips.com does not designate permitted sender hosts)
Received: from 011-smtp-out.Philips.com (23.103.247.180) by AM1FFO11FD026.mail.protection.outlook.com (10.174.64.215) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.306.13 via Frontend Transport; Mon, 26 Oct 2015 12:55:33 +0000
Received: from DB5PR9001MB0167.MGDPHG.emi.philips.com (141.251.190.211) by DB5PR9001MB0165.MGDPHG.emi.philips.com (141.251.190.209) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.306.13; Mon, 26 Oct 2015 12:55:28 +0000
Received: from DB5PR9001MB0167.MGDPHG.emi.philips.com ([141.251.190.211]) by DB5PR9001MB0167.MGDPHG.emi.philips.com ([141.251.190.211]) with mapi id 15.01.0306.003; Mon, 26 Oct 2015 12:55:28 +0000
From: "Kumar, Sandeep" <sandeep.kumar@philips.com>
To: Shahid Raza <periodic@live.com>, Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org>
Thread-Topic: [Dtls-iot] dice wg future work... or time to declare victory?
Thread-Index: AQHRC00nUx4xg2WFpUGpoVfmXTE0tJ50hukAgAACsoCAAAI/gIAJGiSAgAAG3YCAAAO6gIAAC6rg
Date: Mon, 26 Oct 2015 12:55:27 +0000
Message-ID: <e4d2565995a94848a445426360fd21bc@DB5PR9001MB0167.MGDPHG.emi.philips.com>
References: <56265F53.7040108@cs.tcd.ie> <5626624A.6050307@gmx.net> <866AAD58-17FA-46B1-B179-C38A5348C69D@arm.com> <5626666F.7080106@gmx.net> <562E0919.80504@sics.se> <562E0EDB.2060108@tzi.org> <BLU437-SMTP8415915F824FD5FF4249DEAC230@phx.gbl>
In-Reply-To: <BLU437-SMTP8415915F824FD5FF4249DEAC230@phx.gbl>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
x-originating-ip: [85.150.192.178]
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-EOPAttributedMessage: 0
X-Microsoft-Exchange-Diagnostics: 1; AM1FFO11FD026; 1:TFFSLkvvxwZLMZllGf1CFO1TH+QVABPUosWq8k+T60a1kEwifXAvk/w1iHRdskwr1ShPpKfy7Z9LIbCEDulg49HcqHZitBhH5cS6y6I3mT3MCqj/e9pxL3eZWW4trKYMf8i4gQqFCsdcjRK3EE26kvaYM6g69POyWbtuMIzTn1bNsdo0MhD+G+npmIO2YcCmulyojbRqoQ7r2oAt4m8XVTZqNUceT7T+vTdP5KsSAJyOib3gQXPL/E5oIHbar45NEJJaXmkTAPB20XImUa6vWsvDR5NHPJnw60i5T3ZYVY5iWuaaDSW0I2sETsnYxOEsgTQ2cfG+W32PxYQaez+39tbV6S0VHAhLQwazv0JPuzk=
X-Forefront-Antispam-Report: CIP:23.103.247.180; CTRY:; IPV:NLI; EFV:NLI; SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(6009001)(2980300002)(428002)(189002)(55904004)(24454002)(199003)(85714005)(377454003)(374574003)(13464003)(33646002)(97736004)(24736003)(66066001)(5001960100002)(189998001)(23676002)(5001770100001)(5007970100001)(92566002)(11100500001)(47776003)(5004730100002)(6806005)(81156007)(50466002)(19580405001)(10400500002)(2900100001)(76176999)(106116001)(19580395003)(106466001)(69596002)(15975445007)(5008740100001)(54356999)(50986999)(87936001)(108616004)(5003600100002)(93886004)(2950100001)(101416001)(86362001)(16796002)(102836002)(105586002)(163963001); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DBXPR04MB223; H:011-smtp-out.Philips.com; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoDomainNonexistent; MX:1; A:1; LANG:en;
X-Microsoft-Exchange-Diagnostics: 1; DBXPR04MB223; 2:AgUbiHSlMUoLnP1qklRpPrQca7PZYLp0HKtWM9Xf+wjDJPanx/MnKSQi8JM9fvIuFjnxXfh5Sz1l6SiDMdnaBj8zCc88Y2nlwtC+pH7QO+d9D03bQs852682MJO7BLv+GBoi7zdITXlinvAWO6V76yk7yC3s8n1uwIOrN5wxsbA=; 3:XmnSUfbOQOJMP7GeskifENPJLds6OTk4G3br5+N36TQenWq6CtlfUR9KKheV8834siPf2N9mpXvrvHlErPR6F+hk0zEn+tyhMvNs5Jsyi3vK8g/bvzMSMzF44Bg27f/9XalwfmHLtpLDXLl1Xhz6JB32OljLGU+++2YBGLDwjEYdcC4nHRu1e50rGXWBIErFMB21NFcxnRSxRTNULZKUj4gYmiFhr9alrrtLNoal4fs=; 25:JXTKTBR8Fd3FaJ5fbVnsQkVmGAT7uKiTb0JJGL9iUIFmvecJWHmt0zE8XMoMjafRllLcgQQik2c2+fCgsN7QeVlhNlx7Looe7IFjDICm9a9JVuk5FYpoMcycoxk/EwOuby4nFPbwRy+DV5aXylD/h9xW8oSEMwee9jYywRXsEBwHa05rfRavQCXdET2akf+lpGKQd4on8SlMzlzb9wpvALT//JziHa6/dXde5Z+CwobXFeUtZJ9mVL5Eq30rYk4oUpvRP5WYnz2kOYWdHQB2VQ==
X-Microsoft-Antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DBXPR04MB223;
X-Microsoft-Exchange-Diagnostics: 1; DBXPR04MB223; 20: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; 4:rvnxw6C2PVtKhw8OFuBOt64xRb6q2uWbb29Sweitir7axc9krZml67ErN5TN3+lHK88/h/XyL7QyI4jQ0MonKD7WKo6rQW+kXTjonWTVmRAzlPPNtGI19Sj/Yq3vGT2n6ss/vueJoAcrhHPku+kqLX2aNvFekZi/lR+tuzScZKrRimybHwQprcoz9UXKs6C7SxE3IGORWXjJdS8Z1W4jTP1sJis+OufTzIjuta7If2ETVnDjswUyEWpyZuDxn7KgEEG7RrKnkHxuuIrUx9CNYlhg8E3IwZHnTe9/BET5iEJ1AjDFIcB7iQvqKW7d8U+6V3QIYTn/hDEonhPnwOSBnGPg6jTeHd7ErsTJNzYnQMQJbFAJPoSBh+ms8RT3UXxo
X-Microsoft-Antispam-PRVS: <DBXPR04MB223BF2199DAF0011AB333B9E4230@DBXPR04MB223.eurprd04.prod.outlook.com>
X-Exchange-Antispam-Report-Test: UriScan:;
X-Exchange-Antispam-Report-CFA-Test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(601004)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(520078)(3002001)(102215026); SRVR:DBXPR04MB223; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DBXPR04MB223;
X-Forefront-PRVS: 0741C77572
X-Microsoft-Exchange-Diagnostics: =?utf-8?B?MTtEQlhQUjA0TUIyMjM7MjM6WVY1dFhWOGlGZmNEU09sTmhNRUl0Tm43MGZX?= =?utf-8?B?eGp6WHRhUWlhVzFrcERqTVhvRTZ0NnNGTFl4cldUOFB0bGJ5b3NXVWNjbjNm?= =?utf-8?B?N0VmUk5DOENYOVFjK0ZMM2VlZXVRSjB3TlRmSE45MjlXRjhKWllxbWRvanZs?= =?utf-8?B?Wm1DdWxKMCtvbkx2azAyc1pZc1hZKzE3a0l5UnlJWFk0NWp6WjVVTTlaSzBK?= =?utf-8?B?T1JsVVhpYlhkYnA4eFFEY0Q5SzBNOENaZCtDUXh0aTZGK1ZYMGt3QmUremZm?= =?utf-8?B?bzhac2NlZVY2WW9PL1pJcnUwYy93T3RkcTFwdElyQ2NmNncvdGQ3RkoxWW5s?= =?utf-8?B?bTZxUEhDZXFEejdCa0JQQUMxa2tyZ2crcitGVU1WZTVoUXQwNlN1T0VtUElm?= =?utf-8?B?cytDUFNrN2tRcU9MWS9OSVJIM2dnMU5UUCtYUS9mQWhrUmcvV3ZCUXEydEg2?= =?utf-8?B?OGlDaU9LeE9tR01YYTRXVXZNWEdreUVUcHZzWFBEOTJBbk14OEtYb1lkcjd5?= =?utf-8?B?eWcrVTNIQjRudWxZOXAwOUxTQk1aRnZTZlJBWWJqSWQreTVjdWk2YkJHbDFD?= =?utf-8?B?MTcvQTdkSTRzc3NmUnptR1VINmlEaHlqbERpbG5ucmhRT3l4YjBwQncxT3VN?= =?utf-8?B?SitRNVZGVFpUZW1CVzRycHJJMmhxZFdPUnZoS3FCYVo4eHUvNkVMcmUrRGhv?= =?utf-8?B?ZUdjK2xrcjVvV2JZbUtnOG80ZloxalJnS1dDak1CWjNTUVBKU2lrRkMvMW1Z?= =?utf-8?B?VitPTlRPclM3OW5hYzRud0hFenlydHNxdGpTRzNpS1FqTlEwN3U2NytEU2hh?= =?utf-8?B?ZUdUL2RTMSs3RUNOZnJOSmVOWmRWK0ozWnBSeDk4anRrVzFHSkE4aWNVOC9z?= =?utf-8?B?dnlSOHEzeWl2L0pmcWhQT1hnK1RldDAyQWRFSE8wMll0RXFsRlV0VjNZUWwr?= =?utf-8?B?QUU2RUROTS9YSWRHclZRV0plNHdqRTlZSnA0aXBzRzFqRVJNMXlNaDZQNHZp?= =?utf-8?B?WG42L2V1VDRiTDhORldTNjFta29hSU9JTUF3cmVmcGpkckMrN0V0SmxlcFBF?= =?utf-8?B?c05jSjBsTll4VzNFSDVScS9wUmlWSTZ2VGZJaE1RODlLSXRPaDJmRU91aWtk?= =?utf-8?B?R1FRY0FxaURDbzNWOW5WOTNpOXNtTFozU3V5bEJRT0JzUkJUbVFwd0R1Zks4?= =?utf-8?B?Z0pidGpETUZjeTU3MEwwWU5IZXdacXN0TFRYNTFZUmEyQnhMU0p4OU43UVlV?= =?utf-8?B?a3ZJcUpSblpocmoyUTE3L0lRNm5QbUgwdS9MYUdWaUNFRUFHTmdqZFVVOHBy?= =?utf-8?B?Z2Jta21RVFJ0TjVReiszT0FyOFdWVEZpUytxdDFPRHBSdzc3YmpkQXV0WUxr?= =?utf-8?B?SGNyUWVQb2ZnL0VDVVhFTkJWd1ZYS3oyOUppZXc1djMwZXpXN2Vmd2NETG9u?= =?utf-8?B?cTRpbm82RmNHWkliaXdiUFEveHpOVUI2ZUk3WFlZNEkxS2VOMCt2NHRkbFdj?= =?utf-8?B?emJrZHhYSEl5YWgzclhYTFVZWkl6UUszdHNkNVIvS01qQUtZaTdGc1RuVnpS?= =?utf-8?B?Ti9oMFVJTGlSMGRvQWhUbExoVUtEYWNHQlU0Zk9IdXNnRkRsNUtEZXk2M0xI?= =?utf-8?B?V1lsQ0xPQkUzQlNBTXVaZy9Fb0lpWGc2OCt3UmZQTVVmNDRuVXFhbG0wQVNO?= =?utf-8?B?YmVOV3dEYmYzWjBMcG9ONnNuWU42dm9yTG1lVFV3d0pWQTNOQS9EakVNS0hZ?= =?utf-8?B?aUVVSnhXcHVpaDdKakZ1Y0VtUDNBOGxsVVRvZmhSQzdGRlpYMit2bE45Mm5D?= =?utf-8?Q?jwLWI4f4yrs9?=
X-Microsoft-Exchange-Diagnostics: 1; DBXPR04MB223; 5:hs3bAY0yeusK6xHiCnCdXtSTSatUSrKHcN3kufwVKvTBuVgQu/5MTUZ23prnlVwfQi9bxS9SOSkwxLyzfZ1CApSjo5VQhW5jsfw5V8Ueg8ih8T1DFECUGq32pCAAQDQOrG7ypdGLJyJQmEId1Kky5w==; 24:IzentZcuuBvSw6/CcwFXXzXq7uiIif9ra8yYSCIOAOWT+RFLcpbEvWeFnKMABKDhjTIz0zNI6dVGvdiIPZugzFy137Cyq2ar6leXYcRix4U=; 20:I8f9J2Yrr7eow8stGdMqNYSRcTB+5BwXm8U/IR2dXWCidyi9mWjnaFTLntZW3lfK0IsFawR+MiqDtXLsEt5MQQ==
SpamDiagnosticOutput: 1:23
SpamDiagnosticMetadata: NSPM
X-OriginatorOrg: philips.com
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 Oct 2015 12:55:33.8622 (UTC)
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Id: 1a407a2d-7675-4d17-8692-b3ac285306e4
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-OriginalAttributedTenantConnectingIp: TenantId=1a407a2d-7675-4d17-8692-b3ac285306e4; Ip=[23.103.247.180]; Helo=[011-smtp-out.Philips.com]
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-FromEntityHeader: HybridOnPrem
X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DBXPR04MB223
Archived-At: <http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/dtls-iot/hm0yMHPRXrhCe0Dgd4NOwc09xSU>
Cc: Hannes Tschofenig <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>, "dtls-iot@ietf.org" <dtls-iot@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Dtls-iot] dice wg future work... or time to declare victory?
X-BeenThere: dtls-iot@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: DTLS for IoT discussion list <dtls-iot.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/dtls-iot>, <mailto:dtls-iot-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/dtls-iot/>
List-Post: <mailto:dtls-iot@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dtls-iot-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dtls-iot>, <mailto:dtls-iot-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 26 Oct 2015 12:55:44 -0000

I do have to say that Zach and Dorothy did spend quite some effort trying to get DICE on track even with their growing responsibilities outside IETF. Thanks to both!  However DICE was just taken hostage by a few distractors who even till today haven't provided any alternative practical solutions. It sure is a "victory" for the distractors, not for anyone here who wanted to solve a real world problem in a practical way.

When we started DICE, there were quite some good ideas on further improving IoT security with just DTLS (remember DTLS-relay). Either we need more energy and guidance (also from the chairs) or accept that these kind of stuff will be standardized outside IETF. The latter is a sad conclusion of closing DICE.

Sandeep

> -----Original Message-----
> From: dtls-iot [mailto:dtls-iot-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Shahid Raza
> Sent: Monday, October 26, 2015 12:44 PM
> To: Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org>;
> Cc: Hannes Tschofenig <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>;; dtls-iot@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [Dtls-iot] dice wg future work... or time to declare victory?
>
> I also think we are not done with the DICE charter. To complete the work, I
> would prefer current chairs but will not mind new chair(s) if the group is
> closing only because of the unavailability of the current chairs.
>
> Regards
> Shahid
>
> > On 26 Oct 2015, at 12:30, Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org>; wrote:
> >
> >> Let's close the group and cover group communication in the ACE
> >> working group instead.
> >
> > I'm not sure that ACE is the right WG for this, we don't do comsec
> > there (we need it, but import it from elsewhere).
> >
> > (COSE might be the right WG, but that is rather focused on one
> > technology.)
> >
> > One other DICE thing that is still open is DTLS-over-SMS.  No idea
> > whether we have the energy to finish this, but I seem to remember it
> > is mostly done.
> >
> > Grüße, Carsten
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > dtls-iot mailing list
> > dtls-iot@ietf.org
> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dtls-iot
>
> _______________________________________________
> dtls-iot mailing list
> dtls-iot@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dtls-iot

________________________________
The information contained in this message may be confidential and legally protected under applicable law. The message is intended solely for the addressee(s). If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, forwarding, dissemination, or reproduction of this message is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by return e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.