Re: [hybi] Ping/Pong body (was Re: TSV-Directorate review of draft-ietf-hybi-thewebsocketprotocol-07)

Patrick McManus <pmcmanus@mozilla.com> Wed, 25 May 2011 01:05 UTC

Return-Path: <pmcmanus@mozilla.com>
X-Original-To: hybi@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: hybi@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ADE91E0754 for <hybi@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 24 May 2011 18:05:01 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.599
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id OAt-5w1O11JT for <hybi@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 24 May 2011 18:04:59 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from linode.ducksong.com (linode.ducksong.com [64.22.125.164]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2718E06CC for <hybi@ietf.org>; Tue, 24 May 2011 18:04:59 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by linode.ducksong.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id F3FAE10305; Tue, 24 May 2011 21:04:58 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from [192.168.16.226] (cpe-67-253-92-25.maine.res.rr.com [67.253.92.25]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by linode.ducksong.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 0657B102A7; Tue, 24 May 2011 21:04:54 -0400 (EDT)
From: Patrick McManus <pmcmanus@mozilla.com>
To: Takeshi Yoshino <tyoshino@google.com>
In-Reply-To: <BANLkTin2LcHgPH7s4-T_1LJa_UhkigJziw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <ED13A76FCE9E96498B049688227AEA292C6A81E4@TK5EX14MBXC206.redmond.corp.microsoft.com> <4DD9686C.7020509@callenish.com> <BANLkTin2LcHgPH7s4-T_1LJa_UhkigJziw@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Date: Tue, 24 May 2011 21:04:53 -0400
Message-ID: <1306285493.1782.33.camel@ds9>
Mime-Version: 1.0
X-Mailer: Evolution 2.32.2
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Cc: "hybi@ietf.org" <hybi@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [hybi] Ping/Pong body (was Re: TSV-Directorate review of draft-ietf-hybi-thewebsocketprotocol-07)
X-BeenThere: hybi@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: Server-Initiated HTTP <hybi.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/hybi>, <mailto:hybi-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/hybi>
List-Post: <mailto:hybi@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:hybi-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hybi>, <mailto:hybi-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 May 2011 01:05:01 -0000

On Mon, 2011-05-23 at 13:37 +0900, Takeshi Yoshino wrote:

> 
> It's possible that A sends an unsolicited Pong with the same body as a
> Ping sent by B. How do you choose Pong body for unsolicited Pong?

I think that's looking at it backwards.

If B cares about having the mandatory pong reply be matched to B's ping
then B can simply create a non-predictable payload that -07 already
requires to be echoed in the pong. 

No change to the protocol is necessary, right?

>  As initially most of implementors are not interested in using the
> body of Ping and unsolicited Pong, they'll try to use an empty string.
> Some may choose non empty string X for its Ping body but some other
> may also use the same string X for its unsolicited Pongs' body. It
> will be quickly out of control.
> 

If the implementor cares about such things then those bodies are
extremely poor implementation decisions. It makes sense to add some
guidance to the text to help them out, but there is no reason to add
constraints here or change the existing protocol imo. If the implementor
changes their mind about being interested in such things they can change
the implementation of their ping body at the same time.