Re: [ieee-ietf-coord] Fwd: [802.1 - 11898] Proposed PAR: P802.1AR: Standard for Local and metropolitan area networks - Secure Device Identity

[Mick Seaman <[e-mail]>]

Hi Stephen,

This proposed revision PAR for the existing IEEE Std 802.1AR-2009 will 
replace the amendment PAR P802.1ARce which just added P-384 SHA-384.

It turned out during the course of that work that the original 802.1AR 
was not constructed in a way that made extensions to new curves easy. It 
had started life very focused on RSA and ECC curves were shoehorned in 
late in the day. Basically taking the form "X is done like this but if 
you are using ECC then ..".

This resulted in a much longer project than desirable given the pressing 
need for P-384 SHA-384, and much more of a shake up to the document that 
could be justified under an amendment PAR - hence the revision PAR which 
will then be followed by withdrawal of the amendment PAR. That having 
been done it should now be much easier to add new curves (the starting 
point of this project is not a blank sheet or even the existing standard 
but a much updated amendment of the latter). However it would be sad if 
the emergence of new curves further delayed P-384 SHA-384. Having got 
the structured sorted out new curves can be added by an amendment, and 
the process of completing the Revision (as currently) scoped plus the 
addition of a further curve by amendment should not take any longer than 
holding the revision open to add a new curve. It is always quicker to 
take things in bite sized chunks.

I should clarify further than these are not new long lived identifiers. 
They are X.509 certs (and the information around those to support/use 
them in particular ways). They are referenced by (and the way they were 
intended to be used fits with)  RFC 7030 Enrollment over Secure 
Transport (Standards Track), as well as by the informational internet 
draft draft-pritikin-bootstrapping-keyinfrastructures-1 Bootstrapping 
Key Infrastructures. The development of IEEE Std 802.1AR-2009 preceded 
and informed that IETF work with participants attending both groups.

A section on "Privacy considerations" already appears in the P802.1ARce 
draft (related material was already in 802.1AR-2009 but renaming that to 
fit the mood of the times is appropriate) . The "Scope" statement in the 
PAR matches exactly that of the existing IEEE Std 802.1AR.

Mick Seaman

Chair, IEEE 802.1 Security Task Group


On 10/5/2016 3:22 AM, Stephen Farrell wrote:
> Hiya,
>
> On 05/10/16 10:48, Dan Romascanu wrote:
>> Please see below the proposed PAR of IEEE 802.1AR. If there are any
>> questions, comments, or concerns from the IETF participants, please make
>> sure that Glenn Parsons sees them.
> I had a quick look at the PDFs included there and have a
> couple of questions:
>
> 1) Wouldn't it be a fine plan to include consideration of
> the privacy aspects of (new) long-lived identifiers in
> this work? Given that IEEE are rightly considering things
> like MAC address randomisation, the same issues that cause
> us to be interested in that will cause us to want to try
> be privacy sensitive when introducing any new long-lived
> identifiers. The upshot of that might not be any change
> to protocol, but could e.g. be a recommendation for the
> kind(s) of nodes for which these new long-lived identifiers
> are (un)suitable. Equally however, there could be protocol
> features that would be more or less privacy-friendly so
> explicitly considering that seems to me like it'd be a
> good plan.
>
> 2) The PAR refers to NIST curves which is fine. In the IETF
> context there is also a lot of interest in use of the
> "cfrg curves" (Curve25519 and Curve448) which have some
> properties that are desirable from a performance and
> security POV. Similarly, deterministic signatures (i.e.
> not requiring a good random number for each signature)
> have significant security benefits. I wondered if these
> kinds of issue would be in scope? (FWIW I think it'd be
> a good plan if they were also considered.)
>
> Cheers,
> S.
>
>
>> Thanks and Regards,
>>
>> Dan
>>
>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>> From: Glenn Parsons <[e-mail]>
>> Date: Wed, Oct 5, 2016 at 8:25 AM
>> Subject: [802.1 - 11898] Proposed PAR: P802.1AR: Standard for Local and
>> metropolitan area networks - Secure Device Identity
>> To: [e-mail]
>>
>>
>> Ballots due October 23: P802.1Qcc/D1.1, P802.1Xck D0.8
>>    Due October 24: P802c/D1.2
>> For particulars see
>>    www.ieee802.org/1/email-pages/ballots.html
>> This list strips out HTML. For  more format and size rules, see "Sending"
>> at
>> 802.1 list help: www.ieee802.org/1/email-pages/zmqw1113.html
>> -----
>>
>> Colleagues
>> This is a PAR  for a revision -- P802.1AR:  Standard for Local and
>> metropolitan area networks - Secure Device Identity -- for pre-submission
>> to the EC for approval in November.
>> The September 802.1 interim meeting was authorized to discuss this and
>> produced this PAR:
>> http://ieee802.org/1/files/public/docs2016/ar-seaman-rev-
>> draft-par-0916-v02.pdf
>> As well as the accompanying CSD:
>> http://ieee802.org/1/files/public/docs2016/ar-seaman-rev-
>> draft-csd-0916-v02.pdf
>> I would request that this be considered for review by all WGs at the
>> November plenary, and also be considered for approval by the EC.
>> Please let me know if you have any comments or questions.
>> Cheers,
>> Glenn.
>>
>> --
>> Glenn Parsons - Chair, IEEE 802.1
>> [e-mail]<mailto:[e-mail]>
>> [phone]
>>
>>
>>
>> ===
>> Unsubscribe link: mailto:[e-mail]
>> IEEE. Fostering technological innovation and excellence for the benefit of
>> humanity.
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> ieee-ietf-coord mailing list
>> [e-mail]
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ieee-ietf-coord
>>