And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces]
Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com> Mon, 15 July 2019 04:19 UTC
Return-Path: <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B521512006D for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 14 Jul 2019 21:19:24 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.999
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cZ7p978E3IqE for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 14 Jul 2019 21:19:22 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-pl1-x62f.google.com (mail-pl1-x62f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::62f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D7DC4120020 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Sun, 14 Jul 2019 21:19:22 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-pl1-x62f.google.com with SMTP id az7so7609708plb.5 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Sun, 14 Jul 2019 21:19:22 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:references:from:organization:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=oI5R9cTFf0tA8XWNbiuhX1LcPpcZ4wMwp4rp8V7xrqg=; b=BpyaOrD/QEykhVvN7c+fph+VIy3pTabAPAI2/gF4ftpJR7pk87c8oZQqS6fuddc6GQ cds/np93GZS3y2l8TmaWQxQfjPF0AdKd2BkP8ZWcnSTGn/rIDTTVWvGL8aviiQmE9E3+ v5XJl94hh+FV9nPbAyhOUOtVEe4+llBMyM8C2bMTrjz7VxKVT9JwJtyV7tr9xduf0Gd+ Ef8VwHP3Q0+h+iGpacLe+NtHVLZDz1zb5PMourCS5JZZk6dMx4pU1LbrFnNffG8HNWUX BjptES90tu1A4URxbOkSkp09mqrWKykolzJPiXBBjyAsW+htPjwIYThxlmAGPoKU8XYG tD/Q==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:organization :message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to :content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=oI5R9cTFf0tA8XWNbiuhX1LcPpcZ4wMwp4rp8V7xrqg=; b=eCrCLuMpv/VKJBmoaDtNIv0eeRU6bQ85nrp+8JV4iaEuXSMPLe2dtig2KUbmBiIcwX EAWHPboZ+lBo88NJRJosq3h1QDPsiHt2F0k6PKZU/E4yxC7ZXDLqSCWDckeQlImHc806 yZAZkOdOhES4j8Enkv+bSY6BKvbBcvwsMbXbdK3e7E442iTosOcre5fAX8yhEsRxRcuM nh4A2UX3/HIvdyVGtfx3W6aysLGkdkWBF919sn8ASq/LuskmfFAeYnEkwl81BbUyOBo4 xRZaMti/NE8LGie/DaiZ/pNNx+dnPrvtjhzLniSufitpZ5WVNWmEWLosl+sgKuQ9+vaC pZTw==
X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXhnvHMO5hWdW09PEU9RmOyh4M9EIgsHkwusPqp8wWrKE98fF3D CK9khTHYzvti0qHdzH6G3oBT4SbT
X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwF1SOXtdLR292/KtU0DzHEcNvd1eqYB3AItBtigWgrexJjLvLEjp+dzmAdXHfk8WM9Kgd/9g==
X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:2f:: with SMTP id 44mr26527089pla.5.1563164362130; Sun, 14 Jul 2019 21:19:22 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [192.168.178.30] (40.226.69.111.dynamic.snap.net.nz. [111.69.226.40]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 81sm22914198pfx.111.2019.07.14.21.19.20 for <ietf@ietf.org> (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 14 Jul 2019 21:19:21 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces]
To: IETF discussion list <ietf@ietf.org>
References: <406bd6b2-9c6d-bec8-b953-3e5fdd24451c@gmail.com>
From: Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
Organization: University of Auckland
Message-ID: <01643f7a-4bab-12ec-0009-f17d6a44b91e@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2019 16:19:19 +1200
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.8.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <406bd6b2-9c6d-bec8-b953-3e5fdd24451c@gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Language: en-US
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/zGqApAVevFF6mkD9VgW9jpqIJrs>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2019 04:19:25 -0000
Various recent discussions here have made me think that the IETF is at a point where some fundamentals in the standards process, the publication process, and its basic organization need to be re-evaluated and perhaps changed. The goal of course would be to make the IETF more useful, not change for its own sake. It's above my pay grade to decide whether to start an organized approach to this, but in addition to the two opinion pieces mentioned below, please also consider this: https://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~brian/CommentaryIAB.pdf This is about the institution, not the people. Please read the opening disclaimer, and of course comments are welcome, as always. Regards Brian Carpenter On 20-Jun-19 16:24, Brian E Carpenter wrote: > Hi, > > The first document is early input to the 2019-2020 NomCom and to > all those thinking of volunteering for it, or for any of the > open leadership positions: > > Some Thoughts on IETF Community Leadership > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-carpenter-community-leaders-01 > > The second one is also relevant to NomCom, but also to those who > will be involved in the process of identifying the future RFC Series > Editor, and to those who care about the IETF standards process in general: > > Request for Comments > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-carpenter-request-for-comments-01 > > Comments are most welcome, but these documents are both personal opinions. > > Regards > Brian Carpenter >
- A couple of opinion pieces Brian E Carpenter
- Re: A couple of opinion pieces Michael Richardson
- And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Brian E Carpenter
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Melinda Shore
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Jari Arkko
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Christian Huitema
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Leif Johansson
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Richard Barnes
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Leif Johansson
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Leif Johansson
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Richard Barnes
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Leif Johansson
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Melinda Shore
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Keith Moore
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Leif Johansson
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Keith Moore
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Jari Arkko
- RE: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Michael Thornburgh
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Brian E Carpenter
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Jari Arkko
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] lloyd.wood@yahoo.co.uk
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Leif Johansson
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Pete Resnick
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Leif Johansson
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Kathleen Moriarty
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Pete Resnick
- Re: And a third [was: A couple of opinion pieces] Kathleen Moriarty
- Re: [105attendees] Fwd: And a third [was: A coupl… Ted Hardie
- Re: [105attendees] Fwd: And a third [was: A coupl… Ted Hardie