[Isms] FW: Review of draft-ietf-isms-radius-usage-05
"Dave Nelson" <d.b.nelson@comcast.net> Wed, 06 May 2009 04:46 UTC
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From: Dave Nelson <d.b.nelson@comcast.net>
To: isms@ietf.org
Date: Wed, 06 May 2009 00:47:48 -0400
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Subject: [Isms] FW: Review of draft-ietf-isms-radius-usage-05
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> -----Original Message----- > From: Dave Nelson [mailto:d.b.nelson@comcast.net] > Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 11:45 PM > To: 'Eric Rescorla'; secdir@ietf.org; iesg@ietf.org > Cc: draft-ietf-isms-radius-usage@tools.ietf.org; isms- > chairs@tools.ietf.org > Subject: RE: Review of draft-ietf-isms-radius-usage-05 > > Eric Rescorla writes... > > > Subject: Review of draft-ietf-isms-radius-usage-05 > > Thanks for your review and comments. > > > IMO, this document would benefit from a rewrite that makes it a > > lot clearer to someone not enmeshed in the WG. > > Umm. OK. That's a bit disheartening to hear, but useful feedback. > > > As far as I can tell, the idea is to explain how to outsource > > some of the authorization decisions to RADIUS. > > Correct. > > > I found this document extremely difficult to read. I realize that > > the intended audience is for people with a lot of RADIUS and > > SNMP experience... > > That's true. Those are the intended audiences. Additional explanatory > material was added to give each group some background information. > > > ...but despite some familiarity with them, I had > > to work fairly hard to figure out what it was trying to say > > and I'm still not sure. This document would benefit very greatly > > from a diagram explaining how the authors think things are > > supposed to work. > > Diagrams can be useful. We can certainly think about what might be > helpful > in that regard. > > > My big question is how the user authentication decisions are > > expected to be split between (e.g., SSH), and RADIUS. For > > example: > > > > - If the user has a password, who checks it the RADIUS server > > or the NAS? RADIUS certainly can do this. > > The RADIUS server makes the authentication decision. If the credential is > a > password, as is the typical use case, the password is sent (hidden) in a > RADIUS Access-Request message. > > > - If the user is authenticating with SSH pubkey auth, who > > checks that? > > The SSH server, i.e. the NAS. SSH is used to create a protected transport > session (a tunnel, if you will) and the RADIUS credentials are obtained > from > the SSH server implementation in the NAS and used by the RADIUS client in > the NAS to authenticate the user with the RADIUS server. Of course, it > has > to be an authentication method that RADIUS supports, and SSH public key is > not one of those. > > > These seem like important architectural issues but I'm not getting > > them out of the document, and they should in particular > > be in the security considerations. > > I'll re-read the document with your questions in mind. Of course, as a > draft author and a RADIUS expert, I may have overlooked some unstated > assumptions. > > > S 2. > > I don't understand what the difference is between service authorization > > and access control in this context. > > Service Authorization means that the user is authorized to (a) manage the > NAS and (b) use SNMP in particular as the management mechanism. Access > Control Authorization relates to the SNMP Access Control Subsystem and > could > be thought of as analogous to access control lists or packet filters or > any > similar fine-granularity access control mechanism. > > > S 2.3. > > I don't get the SHOULDs here. If you're defining how code points are > > set, why are these optional? > > OK, let's look at each one of these: > > RADIUS servers compliant to this specification SHOULD use RADIUS > service provisioning attributes, as described herein, to specify > SNMP access over a secure transport. > > This one could arguably be a MUST. In fact, I tend to think it ought to > be > a MUST. > > The following RADIUS attributes SHOULD be used, as hint attributes > included in the Access-Request message to signal use of SNMP over > a secure transport (i.e. authPriv) to the RADIUS server: > > RADIUS documents have traditionally held that appropriate "hint" > attributes > are desirable in an Access-Request message, but that they are optional. > This preserves that tradition. I suppose this could be changed to MUST > without impacting interoperability with RADIUS servers, which are always > free to ignore such hints.
- [Isms] FW: Review of draft-ietf-isms-radius-usage… Dave Nelson
- [Isms] FW: Review of draft-ietf-isms-radius-usage… Dave Nelson
- Re: [Isms] FW: Review of draft-ietf-isms-radius-u… David Harrington