Re: [ipwave] FW: Shepherd review of draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211ocb-12

[Alexandre Petrescu <[e-mail]>]

Le 06/02/2018 à 18:40, Abdussalam Baryun a écrit :
> Hi Alex and Francois,
> 
> I don't mind putting any clear definition in terms but should be used in 
> the body consistently within the draft.

IP-OBU and IP-RSU are used in the text.  We are not using DSRC, DSRCS, 
OBU nor RSU in the text.

> Also we need to try to make the 
> definition short and to the point. I am not very interested in this 
> IP-xxx, however, I like the terminology used in RFC8200. so we should 
> mention that our IP-units are nodes or routers,

Noted.

> in terminology the 
> definition word 'computer' used is not consistent with other ietf RFCs.

'computer' is generic enough to not need a definition.

I used 'computer' to solve the problem of saying 'Host' vs saying 
'Router'.  That debate is not solved and we wont solve it here.

Alex

> 
> AB
> 
> On Tue, Feb 6, 2018 at 6:47 PM, Alexandre Petrescu 
> <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
>     Le 06/02/2018 à 17:40, François Simon a écrit :
> 
>         Mr. Petrescu,
> 
>         /“//There are two very relevant terms: IP-OBU and IP-RSU.//”///
> 
>         -// IftheWorkingGroupthinksthese terms are relevant, thenso
>         bid.Irespectfully disagree.Furthermore,I have nothing more to
>         add to this discussion;I have provided allUS relevant definitions.
> 
> 
>     I thank you for the definitions.
> 
>     I propose we go this way:
> 
>     Copy the definitions from your emails for DSRCS, and then DSRC and
>     then OBU and RSU in terms of DSRCS and of DSRC.
> 
>     But have these definitions (DSRCS, DSRC, OBU and RSU) in an
>     Appendix, not in the Terminology section.
> 
>     The Terminology section would list IP-OBU and IP-RSU and refer to
>     the Appendix.
> 
>     Alex
> 
> 
>         Sincerely,
> 
>         Francois Simon
> 
>         Lojik Technologies
> 
>         -----Original Message-----
>         From: Alexandre Petrescu [mailto:[e-mail]
>         <mailto:[e-mail]>]
>         Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2018 10:41 AM
>         To: François Simon <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>>
>         Cc: [e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>
>         Subject: Re: FW: [ipwave] Shepherd review of
>         draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211ocb-12
> 
>         If I add DSRCS, and DSRC, and OBU - it makes for 3 terms only
>         tangentially relevant.
> 
>         I find it too much.
> 
>         There are two very relevant terms: IP-OBU and IP-RSU.
> 
>         We need to have more relevant terms than tangentially relevant
>         terms.
> 
>         Le 06/02/2018 à 03:25, François Simon a écrit :
> 
>             /"//So, in order to define OBU in terms of DSRCS one has to
>             define
> 
> 
>             first DSRCS, all while caring to avoid loops.  I think it
>             can become
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> 
>             too lengthy.//"///
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> 
>             -///Dedicated Short-Range Communications////Services
>             (DSRCS)/.-The use
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>             of radio techniquesto transfer data over short distancesbetween
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>             roadside and mobile
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>                       units, between mobile units, and betweenportable
>             and mobile
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>                       units to performoperations related to the
>             improvementof traffic
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>                       flow, traffic safety,
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>                       and other intelligent transportationservice
>             applications in a
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>                       varietyof environments. DSRCS systems mayalso
>             transmit status
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>                       and instructional
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>                       messages related to the units involved.[ Ref. 47
>             CFR90.7 –
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> 
>                       Definitions]
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> 
> 
>             -----Original Message-----
> 
> 
>             From: Alexandre Petrescu
>             [mailto:[e-mail]
>             <mailto:[e-mail]>]
> 
> 
>             Sent: Monday, February 05, 2018 10:41 AM
> 
> 
>             To: François Simon <[e-mail]
>             <mailto:[e-mail]><mailto:[e-mail]
>             <mailto:[e-mail]>>>
> 
> 
>             Cc:[e-mail]
>             <mailto:[e-mail]><mailto:[e-mail]
>             <mailto:[e-mail]>>
> 
> 
>             Subject: Re: [ipwave] Shepherd review of
> 
> 
>             draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211ocb-12
> 
> 
> 
> 
>             Le 05/02/2018 à 16:10, François Simon a écrit :
> 
> 
> 
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>                 /"//Is DSRCS a typo? (correct DSRC).//"///
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>                 -// No typo. DSRCS stands for “Dedicated Short Range
>                 Communication Service”
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>             So, in order to define OBU in terms of DSRCS one has to
>             define first
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> 
>             DSRCS, all while caring to avoid loops.  I think it can
>             become too lengthy.
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> 
> 
> 
>             Alex
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> 
> 
>                 -----Original Message-----
> 
> 
> 
> 
>                 From: Alexandre Petrescu
>                 [mailto:[e-mail]
>                 <mailto:[e-mail]>]
> 
> 
> 
> 
>                 Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2018 11:08 AM
> 
> 
> 
> 
>                 To: François Simon <[e-mail]
>                 <mailto:[e-mail]><mailto:[e-mail]
>                 <mailto:[e-mail]><mailto:[e-mail]
>                 <mailto:[e-mail]><mailto:[e-mail]
>                 <mailto:[e-mail]>>>>
> 
> 
> 
> 
>                 Cc:[e-mail]
>                 <mailto:[e-mail]><mailto:[e-mail]
>                 <mailto:[e-mail]>>
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> 
> 
> 
>                 Subject: Re: [ipwave] Shepherd review of
> 
> 
> 
> 
>                 draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211ocb-12
> 
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>                 I am adding this OBU ref for reference but I have a
>                 question:
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>                 Le 02/02/2018 à 11:23, François Simon a écrit :
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>                 [...]
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>                     /On-Board unit (OBU). An On-Board Unit is a DSRCS
>                     transceiver that
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>                     is
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>                 Is DSRCS a typo? (correct DSRC).
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>                 Alex
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>                     normally mounted in or on a vehicle, or which in
>                     some instances may
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>                     be
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>                     a portable unit. An OBU can be operational while a
>                     vehicle or person
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>                     is either mobile or stationary. The OBUs receive and
>                     contend for
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>                     time
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>                     to transmit on one or more radio frequency (RF)
>                     channels. Except
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>                     where
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>                     specifically excluded, OBU operation is permitted
>                     wherever vehicle
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>                     operation or human passage is permitted. The OBUs
>                     mounted in
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>                     vehicles
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>                     are licensed by rule under part 95 of this chapter
>                     and communicate
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>                     with Roadside Units (RSUs) and other OBUs. Portable
>                     OBUs are also
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>                     licensed by rule under part 95 of this chapter. OBU
>                     operations in
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>                     the
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>                     Unlicensed National Information Infrastructure
>                     (UNII) Bands follow
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>                     the
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>                     rules in those bands./- [CFR 90.7 - Definitions] -
>                     October 2010
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>                     *IPWAVE Issue***
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>                     **
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>                     /“The problem with the FCC definition of OBU is that
>                     it has no
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>                     relationship to IP.  Worse, that FCC definition has
>                     no indication
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>                     that
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>                     it MAY use IP somehow.  And here we say that all
>                     OBUs must use IP.
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>                     Do
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>                     you see what I mean?”///
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>                     //
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>                     Correct; the OBU has no relationship with IP and is
>                     not intended to.
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>                     IP is a network protocol.  If an On-Board Unit (OBU)
>                     device is
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>                     required to exchange IP, it needs to be dealt in
>                     protocol(s) and/or
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>                     Management in higher layers similar to WAVE within
>                     the On-Board Equipment (OBE) .
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>                     /“Do you think FCC will mind if we use the term OBU
>                     in this draft to
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>                     mean something else?  I, and a colleague, think that
>                     FCC would not
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>                     mind.”///
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>                     //
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>                     Depending of the reader. If one is familiar with
>                     DSRC, OBU and RSU
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>                     as
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>                     defined by FCC will come in mind. As far as I know,
>                     “OBU” and “RSU”
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>                     are not registered and could be used for other
>                     definitions
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>                     (something
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>                     like
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>                     “ATM”: Asynchronous Transfer Mode and Automatic
>                     Teller Machine😊).
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>                     My
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>                     suggestion to the IPWAVE team is to use “OBE and RSE”.
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>                     This is my personal view as I donot represent any
>                     involved interest.
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>                     If any one has questions, let me know.
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>                     Francois Simon
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>                     Lojik Technologies
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>                     -----Original Message-----
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>                     From: its [mailto:[e-mail]
>                     <mailto:[e-mail]>] On Behalf Of Alexandre
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>                     Petrescu
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>                     Sent: Monday, January 29, 2018 10:08 AM
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>                     To:[e-mail]
>                     <mailto:[e-mail]><mailto:[e-mail]
>                     <mailto:[e-mail]>>
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>                     Subject: Re: [ipwave] Shepherd review of
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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>                     draft-ietf-ipwave-ipv6-over-80211ocb-12
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>                     Le 29/01/2018 à 15:52, François Simon a écrit :
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>                         My comments arewithin the text*[Fygs.......]*.
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>                     [...]
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>                         In the terminology section, the OBU term is
>                         mentioned to be defined
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>                         outside the IETF. This is fine, but we have to
>                         provide a reference.
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>                         And even with that, it would not harm to include
>                         some short
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>                         definition
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>                         to provide context. The RSU term is also defined
>                         outside the IETF
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>                         and
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>                         there is quite a lot of text provided (I think
>                         the relevant part is
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>                         the last sentence, the one starting with "The
>                         difference between...").
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>                         Both terms should be handled in the same way.
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>                         *[Fygs: The**definitions**was issued by the FCC
>                         20 years ago.  I
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>                         have
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