[MMUSIC] draft-davis-valverde-srtp-assurance [was: Re: [dispatch] IETF 117 - do you have something for DISPATCH?]

Dan Wing <danwing@gmail.com> Mon, 17 July 2023 19:40 UTC

Return-Path: <danwing@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: mmusic@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: mmusic@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C1BB8C15EB2E; Mon, 17 Jul 2023 12:40:52 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -7.094
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-7.094 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, URIBL_DBL_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, URIBL_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xJnYixwx-GCz; Mon, 17 Jul 2023 12:40:52 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-pl1-x62a.google.com (mail-pl1-x62a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::62a]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2666BC15198F; Mon, 17 Jul 2023 12:40:52 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-pl1-x62a.google.com with SMTP id d9443c01a7336-1b9c5e07c1bso38825655ad.2; Mon, 17 Jul 2023 12:40:52 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20221208; t=1689622851; x=1692214851; h=to:cc:date:message-id:subject:mime-version:from:from:to:cc:subject :date:message-id:reply-to; bh=i1Qfuif53DP2vWrksCz4dRl0v8bmypqAh5smYXSg8jQ=; b=aisXfqOQDRf/7rTHuonlZ25SEmpohcMbMZmcZVCBsNGhJlWRs3tuzJ9DfPhpUkhtLF 23Fg1GM9bM1mH51oFFhYiaDTMIjkq65ihd2Of37P6bpsOd49AVAfBqXLxWZPc2WlWLwl 2HgKS7fHfYSWtxQTy0zpcez4vLMEohNYXEakPxWf5YasrVG0cN+MHaIZmkJJyXWAq2Hs Gl5S/01Fw/+494UTQ44Pnn8Qrvz9mNDum02QiYrw5Vxymh4f96OcO5XyE2/0qKjbS9p/ sqTTazDxmVmKfyNv1RAHA29YV6OlvmNVijwEna0gGT2Y4q2C9XbdbahH44ENXTT6DyIr cSGw==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20221208; t=1689622851; x=1692214851; h=to:cc:date:message-id:subject:mime-version:from:x-gm-message-state :from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=i1Qfuif53DP2vWrksCz4dRl0v8bmypqAh5smYXSg8jQ=; b=TD4bZJsRkwmtX4CPNvMNaYIwA15Ry8XOIYQhh+5DfTUzX4/am+LWXUDBaTHAglS+f8 57u1GDoFp2/qO1aqpSYw/QV2uNqLM8zhXKrxtFN7wRN1xCdPpa8UkO0xtgUkrwToc+/n wJd9Su8osxNpKt+giK2V0kiiZXF8Hzfj23HX8CF1OUoZJPI7EwiycVhWs9jjnsFW/Dw0 HMrDZI54pGkqZtyFpLNsTXfUlXArtwONwPeP3LL3LEYhctLGNf91ga2TxWZDBUCeDAB9 +D3sdDIsHQ73xeDX6vSy4+djwH/0ekzD5Dfknlq2bR95bJIC18VHTWcxHXomGoILhara Hnkw==
X-Gm-Message-State: ABy/qLYOPs6ogsrxHVTnTcaYCES7ZdYU8glNI2idoa51oRR1cuwcEhh/ tBVJXLQoJkybTFrnFjZVUgJnqzA5nL8f7Q==
X-Google-Smtp-Source: APBJJlHJ5/7DgeZcDloPCagto9uMhBSbPxj0Taz5/LMKP6VjBNTBWDliXjhtoJqIePTt4z1QbnTNHA==
X-Received: by 2002:a17:903:2445:b0:1b7:f24c:3b9a with SMTP id l5-20020a170903244500b001b7f24c3b9amr15755215pls.47.1689622851140; Mon, 17 Jul 2023 12:40:51 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from smtpclient.apple ([47.208.218.46]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id f2-20020a170902ff0200b001b8a8154f3fsm223873plj.270.2023.07.17.12.40.50 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 17 Jul 2023 12:40:50 -0700 (PDT)
From: Dan Wing <danwing@gmail.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_08BF31B8-7BE9-4035-9A1C-36A418B6476C"
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3731.600.7\))
Message-Id: <0490249B-C51B-4E18-8155-144CE044E994@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2023 12:40:49 -0700
Cc: kydavis@cisco.com, Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com>, mmusic@ietf.org
To: dispatch@ietf.org
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3731.600.7)
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/mmusic/NSKBPxSXVmE-C7Uqi51NZw8R_yg>
Subject: [MMUSIC] draft-davis-valverde-srtp-assurance [was: Re: [dispatch] IETF 117 - do you have something for DISPATCH?]
X-BeenThere: mmusic@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.39
Precedence: list
List-Id: Multiparty Multimedia Session Control Working Group <mmusic.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/mmusic>, <mailto:mmusic-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/mmusic/>
List-Post: <mailto:mmusic@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:mmusic-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mmusic>, <mailto:mmusic-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2023 19:40:52 -0000

Yeah, it feels like draft-davis-valverde-srtp-assurance could go straight to MMUSIC.

The I-D needs to discuss what happens when SSRC collision occurs, which I think is "send new SDP indicating the new SSRC and ROC=0".

I would like to understand where EKT-SRTP (RFC8870) fails to meet needs.  The design of EKT-SRTP avoids signaling SSRC or ROC in the signaling channel and, instead, allow them both to be indicated in the SRTP channel itself.  This design allows SSRC collisions to be handled very much like how they are handled with RTP (that is, without the "S").  I would rather see RFC8870 extended to work with SDP Security Descriptions because it moves us on a path towards DTLS-SRTP:  DTLS-SRTP-signaled endpoints could interop with SDP Security Descriptions-signaled endpoints because they're both using EKT to handle SSRC/ROC and key changes when group membership changes.  We really should be deprecating SDP Security Descriptions because it has far worse security properties compared with DTLS-SRTP.

-d


> Hi Kyzer (et. al.) -
> 
> Why aren't you taking this straight to mmusic? Am I missing something 
> that says that's not the obvious place for the work?
> 
> RjS
> 
> 
> On 6/27/23 7:31 AM, Kyzer Davis (kydavis) wrote:
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > I would like to request a bit of dispatch time for the draft just posted:
> >
> > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-davis-valverde-srtp-assurance/
> >
> > I also plan to attend IETF 117 in person to represent.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
>