Re: [multipathtcp] MP_CAP Final ack drop and fallback behavior
Christoph Paasch <christoph.paasch@uclouvain.be> Thu, 25 July 2013 08:30 UTC
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Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2013 10:29:57 +0200
From: Christoph Paasch <christoph.paasch@uclouvain.be>
To: Krishna Khanal <krishna.khanal2@citrix.com>
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Cc: multipathtcp <multipathtcp@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [multipathtcp] MP_CAP Final ack drop and fallback behavior
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Hello, On 25/07/13 - 08:26:24, Krishna Khanal wrote: > Hi Christoph, Yes server sending its willingness but letting client decide > on the reliability of final ack looks better. > > In my experience, there is significant fallback due to receiving data > packet before final ack, though I don't have exact data to share here. > Anyone having any experience with this? are you using the Linux implementation as a client? I would be surprised if you have so many fallbacks, because you would need a drop of the third ACK. Thus you maybe have a high loss-rate on the path (?). Cheers, Christoph > > Regards, Krishna > > > -----Original Message----- From: Christoph Paasch > [mailto:christoph.paasch@uclouvain.be] Sent: Thursday, July 25, 2013 1:18 > PM To: Krishna Khanal Cc: multipathtcp Subject: Re: [multipathtcp] MP_CAP > Final ack drop and fallback behavior > > Hello Krishna, > > On 25/07/13 - 04:51:13, Krishna Khanal wrote: > > What about setting a flag in the SYNACK packet to tell the peer about > > the reliability of the final ack? If the administrator thinks it is ok > > to put a client on hold for an RTT, then they can set the flag in the > > synack packet and force client to do reliable transmission of final ack. > > I'm not against this flag. But, it should just be a signal of the server > for the client, saying "I'm doing stateless connection establishment". In > the end, it's the client who will decide if he wants to trade this > additional RTT for assured MPTCP-connectivity or not. > > > Cheers, Christoph > > > > -----Original Message----- From: Christoph Paasch > > [mailto:christoph.paasch@uclouvain.be] Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 > > 2:39 PM To: Krishna Khanal Cc: multipathtcp Subject: Re: [multipathtcp] > > MP_CAP Final ack drop and fallback behavior > > > > Hello Krishna, > > > > On 24/07/13 - 08:05:40, Krishna Khanal wrote: > > > Hi, For stateless implementation of MP_CAPABLE flow, there is no way > > > to continue with MPTCP if the final ack of 3-way MP_CAP handshake is > > > dropped or the data packet is received before the MP_CAP ack due to > > > out of ordering of the packet in the network. Only way to continue > > > with the transaction is to fallback to regular TCP and there is a > > > pretty much chance of happening this in the real network. So, there is > > > always a requirement of fallback even if the middle devices supports > > > and understands MPTCP. > > > > > > Is there any thought on making MP_CAP final ack reliable like MP_JOIN > > > final ack or including MP_CAP final ack options with the data packet > > > along with DSS packet until the ack is received? Second, option may > > > not be suitable because it consumes all the option space and first > > > option also tend to increase the handshake duration and block the > > > request by atleast an RTT. > > > > > > Any thought? > > > > In the beginning of MPTCP, the third ACK with the MP_CAPABLE was sent in > > a reliable way, as it is done today for the third ACK with the MP_JOIN. > > But this got removed due to the additional RTT: > > > > http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/multipathtcp/current/msg01529.html > > > > > > Then, the status of the draft was for some time that MPTCP was doing > > reliable transmission of the third ACK+MP_CAPABLE, but allowed sending > > data before the arrival of this third ACK. However, this did not help, > > as early arrival of data (prior to the third ACK) will still trigger a > > fallback. So, the MPTCP-draft changed to a non-retransmitting third-ack > > as it is for today: > > > > http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/multipathtcp/current/msg01699.html > > > > > > It would not be possible to combine MP_CAPABLE with the DSS-option and > > still use stateless connection establishment: > > > > MP_CAPABLE: 20 bytes DSS-option: 4 bytes (header) + 4 bytes (DSN) + 4 > > bytes (Subflow-seq) + 4 bytes (Data-length + csum) = 16 bytes > > > > So, there are 4 more bytes left. This would mean that we cannot put the > > Timestamp-option, which is required for stateless connection > > establishment. > > > > > > > > Cheers, Christoph
- [multipathtcp] draft agenda for Berlin meeting Yoshifumi Nishida
- [multipathtcp] MP_CAP Final ack drop and fallback… Krishna Khanal
- Re: [multipathtcp] MP_CAP Final ack drop and fall… Christoph Paasch
- Re: [multipathtcp] MP_CAP Final ack drop and fall… Krishna Khanal
- Re: [multipathtcp] MP_CAP Final ack drop and fall… Christoph Paasch
- Re: [multipathtcp] MP_CAP Final ack drop and fall… Krishna Khanal
- Re: [multipathtcp] MP_CAP Final ack drop and fall… Christoph Paasch
- Re: [multipathtcp] MP_CAP Final ack drop and fall… Krishna Khanal
- Re: [multipathtcp] MP_CAP Final ack drop and fall… Yoshifumi Nishida
- Re: [multipathtcp] MP_CAP Final ack drop and fall… Krishna Khanal
- Re: [multipathtcp] MP_CAP Final ack drop and fall… Yoshifumi Nishida
- Re: [multipathtcp] draft agenda for Berlin meeting philip.eardley
- [multipathtcp] draft agenda for Berlin meeting Yoshifumi Nishida