Re: [netmod] Does defining a feature require the module be implemented?

Andy Bierman <andy@yumaworks.com> Fri, 20 May 2022 17:17 UTC

Return-Path: <andy@yumaworks.com>
X-Original-To: netmod@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: netmod@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9E40C19E859 for <netmod@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 20 May 2022 10:17:01 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.098
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=yumaworks.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Rkgo_pfN9BsZ for <netmod@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 20 May 2022 10:16:57 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-yb1-xb2d.google.com (mail-yb1-xb2d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::b2d]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AFD37C19E857 for <netmod@ietf.org>; Fri, 20 May 2022 10:16:57 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-yb1-xb2d.google.com with SMTP id q135so15248177ybg.10 for <netmod@ietf.org>; Fri, 20 May 2022 10:16:57 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yumaworks.com; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=t+lcjmzAdOfb+yHiQ0FtCNuPSEjHSYCI0/EJDBUSHlE=; b=mXBfsvuj5hTvFfKYifyo/JMQMKzFkpn/ApRFSDUHB6qi13C3hoYi5VnvJG1kpoelj3 Ynm1Y0LIMVM5WyzBoMjVYMfxUBsjvZodeHEHs1K2341dvdZ4KGGywDN4QFwXFFPCdy8J iFMwdkczdpSQ7skEibQXoXAcaMgx/0qu8gFWonXUBon1i/V3YDpRUBBbpLN5d2UNZ18n DxUo1Moz4RkS/2tJHJ5IrZ4sC7HBksk7+u6WjSokeXljlJZb8FE7ojsmrTs26yrzorEg meXfl0CYHpd5d0bmxHDzJR2iUeV9a84wq/nLmY/ytZ3LDNUqDjIlQjXrUfzbeOsWO+4z PD1w==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=t+lcjmzAdOfb+yHiQ0FtCNuPSEjHSYCI0/EJDBUSHlE=; b=DRn1OmAxhk7Njvub7G8xBrMAveCAc518jVYeVdsQin+Kt9nSJFCTAPGRCoUZVQmo6g qI59uVI0mPeowxx+/rLNy/aqu7mOF/3Mk3swdiVYQIiYPbqSFC6H1Q9O1Ww3io5fQVOv opq46j99h7ZTmgsqXPa2LvFJxPTzZf+2vfKL/K4RFMeN7PIBkinY7/xFhuoMOwAsG24R Gf8QULKdgWupORDbOQyEhwWFC/E7Wq4dStWk3UzOAY+3g3QBa7FXxZsh5k40An3XqSw3 5FWUYzI5uh9lJjs3WSWmIU9Pxc+RJywB2xBzjcOtUtl83y2D6LrIBEeTthsZ7NQsmkTi zbaA==
X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531fvXNRjAwdcliSw3ab9AAKXTqtEEpkOGwIhBKhTfPNP5f24oXj 9/yyD44ACFQx8OQd1XZAu9bVbqQmaEH2V8oMKaWBgZCvL9M=
X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyQf+Mu1a9sxLQ1kBtpvfZ0nOd5fb1r2LOBBzGfMJZ4UvjOX7RJoJoTWLeJVvTBzaeEUhSbUPXua04eCpzyt0E=
X-Received: by 2002:a05:6902:727:b0:64f:4e29:a854 with SMTP id l7-20020a056902072700b0064f4e29a854mr6894479ybt.262.1653067016067; Fri, 20 May 2022 10:16:56 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <01000180a9eb37cb-85b9c576-c1eb-425a-b42c-b3cabe548fbb-000000@email.amazonses.com> <20220518.080543.825575420363032441.id@4668.se> <01000180d793d6ee-f82a4a03-28d8-4f8b-909e-7306a7fc565b-000000@email.amazonses.com> <20220519.090452.636208001533389643.id@4668.se> <CABCOCHQMregbZwY0vOZbYkjwzzPp-JHjDK3tWcVnw_fj3+zv8w@mail.gmail.com> <01000180e19bcd37-22dd5fc0-b39b-4d92-ab51-7bbbfbe653e1-000000@email.amazonses.com>
In-Reply-To: <01000180e19bcd37-22dd5fc0-b39b-4d92-ab51-7bbbfbe653e1-000000@email.amazonses.com>
From: Andy Bierman <andy@yumaworks.com>
Date: Fri, 20 May 2022 10:16:45 -0700
Message-ID: <CABCOCHR_pb4JSpjFA0PAX2a4bybkVxu9xRx=AxRkWs9QVFC9Qg@mail.gmail.com>
To: Kent Watsen <kent+ietf@watsen.net>
Cc: Martin Björklund <mbj+ietf@4668.se>, "netmod@ietf.org" <netmod@ietf.org>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000048702005df74a82f"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/netmod/3Vrzk8XWWFiL7C5MdnX-uoqb4ls>
Subject: Re: [netmod] Does defining a feature require the module be implemented?
X-BeenThere: netmod@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.34
Precedence: list
List-Id: NETMOD WG list <netmod.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/netmod>, <mailto:netmod-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/netmod/>
List-Post: <mailto:netmod@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:netmod-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod>, <mailto:netmod-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 May 2022 17:17:01 -0000

On Fri, May 20, 2022 at 6:15 AM Kent Watsen <kent+ietf@watsen.net> wrote:

> Martin, Andy,
>
> > 2) If it is the case that the module must be implemented to use its
>> > features, then I need to update some of my modules (e.g., crypto-types
>> > and friends) to explicitly disable the protocol-accessible tree when
>> > the module is implemented *only* to use its features.
>>
>> Since RFC 8525 doesn't allow a feature to be supported w/o also
>> implementing the module, I think this is the solution for now.  And it
>> is not wrong even if RFC 8525 was updated to support features from
>> imported modules.
>>
>
> Deviation-stmts would be required to "undo" the base module implementation
> requirement.
>
> Looks like RFC 7895 got this part right.
> The 'feature' leaf-list may apply to imported modules.
> The same feature can only appear once, no matter how many revisions
> of a module are imported.
>
>
> I feel vindicated, but also feel that Martin is right about this being the
> solution for now.  I don't even feel that it is necessarily bad.  But I do
> think we should act on this in some way.  Here are some options:
>
> 1) put a "document only" errata on RFC 8525.
> 2) put a "document only" errata on RFC 7950.
> 3) put a "document only" errata on RFC 8407.
> 4) file a YANG Next issue.
> 5) some combination of the above.
> 6) anything else?
>
>
I do not think an Errata can fix this issue because the split
between 'module' and 'import-only-module' was intentional.

Going back to iana-crypt-hash (again).

 - the features are not intended for use in any if-feature-stmts
 - each feature is related to one variant for values of the crypt-hash type

Features are like identities.
They are completely decoupled from the schema tree and simply
use the parent module to create a unique QName for reference in other
statements.

Perhaps we should work on some proposed edits for yang-next.




> Kent
>

Andy