Re: [OSPF] Advertising S-BFD discriminators in OSPF
Michael Barnes <mjbarnes@cisco.com> Fri, 26 September 2014 14:12 UTC
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Date: Fri, 26 Sep 2014 07:12:25 -0700
From: Michael Barnes <mjbarnes@cisco.com>
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To: Acee Lindem <acee@lindem.com>
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Subject: Re: [OSPF] Advertising S-BFD discriminators in OSPF
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Hi Acee, I obviously missed this part of the discussion for rfc5088. Thanks for drawing my attention to this. Regards, Michael On 09/26/2014 04:49 AM, Acee Lindem wrote: > Hi Michael, Manav, Karsten, > > We did have this discussion back when we put the first piece of > non-OSPF information in the OSPF RI LSA and conceded that the OSPF RI > LSA could be used for all types of information. > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/rfc5088/ > > On the same subject, I have further conceded that this will be used > for variable length information and am doing a bis version of the > RFC4970 accommodating multiple instance of the RI LSA. I will be > presenting the updates in Honolulu. > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-acee-ospf-rfc4970bis/ > > Thanks, Acee P.S. I’m glad I didn’t reply last night - we might have > missed out on all the analogies ;^). > > > On Sep 26, 2014, at 4:08 AM, Karsten Thomann > <karsten_thomann@linfre.de> wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> RFC 4970 Section 3 includes: >> >> The purpose of the Router Information (RI) LSA is to advertise >> information relating to the aggregate OSPF router. Normally, this >> should be confined to TLVs with a single value or very few values. >> It is not meant to be a generic container to carry any and all >> information. >> >> I think the first sentence allows it, as it is related to the ospf >> router, even if it is not an ospf internal information. Michael is >> right that not everything should be in the RI LSA as already >> mentioned in the RFC, increasing the count of LSAs which need to >> be flooded across the domain has also drawbacks in term of >> scalability. >> >> Regards, >> >> Karsten >> >> >> Am 26.09.2014 08:58, schrieb Manav Bhatia: >>> Hi Michael, >>> >>> :-) >>> >>> Lets not deal with analogies (my bad!) lest we get misled by >>> those. >>> >>> Clearly you and I look at RI LSAs differently. I dont think what >>> youre suggesting is even remotely preposterous. However, i do >>> believe that RIs can serve more than merely announcing OSPF >>> specific router capabilities. >>> >>> And once again, we already have a precedent where RI was used >>> for announcing non OSPF specific capability -- which means that >>> the co-authors of this draft arent the only ones who think of RIs >>> as being a generic tool for router capability advertisement. >>> >>> Lets hear what others have to say on this. >>> >>> Cheers, Manav >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Sep 26, 2014 at 11:53 AM, Michael Barnes >>> <mjbarnes@cisco.com> wrote: >>>> Hi Manav, >>>> >>>> That's a pretty funny analogy. I've got another one for you. >>>> >>>> Say the RI LSA is like a corporate learjet for a tool company. >>>> When it gets flown around it's never full so you decide to use >>>> it to ship wrenches on it along with the executives. You're >>>> proud of your wrenches and want everyone to know how great they >>>> are, but do you really want to ship them that way? Maybe it's >>>> better to put the wrenches in their own vehicle. >>>> >>>> So to be a little more serious, if the router wants to proudly >>>> proclaim its S-BFD capability then it deserves its own special >>>> LSA rather than being packed into one used for other things. >>>> >>>> Cheers, Michael >>>> >>>> >>>> On 09/25/2014 06:27 PM, Manav Bhatia wrote: >>>>> Hi Michael, >>>>> >>>>> Very interesting. >>>>> >>>>> I think there is a disconnect because of our interpretation >>>>> of what an RI LSA is envisioned to carry. I assume its meant >>>>> to advertise "optional router capabilities" while you believe >>>>> its to be used solely for advertising "optional OSPF router >>>>> capabilities". IMO, limiting the scope of RI to just OSPF is >>>>> like using a humvee with all its bells and whistles to >>>>> distribute balloons to the children in your friendly >>>>> neighborhood park! We wanted a mechanism wherein each router >>>>> could proudly tell the world that it was an S-BFD capable >>>>> node and along with it also advertise the unique >>>>> discriminator that the others would use to reach it. RI we >>>>> felt, was the perfect tool that we could use for this >>>>> purpose. >>>>> >>>>> And btw we're not the first ones to use RI for advertising a >>>>> router capability that isnt pertinent to OSPF per se (RFC >>>>> 5088). >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, Manav >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Sep 26, 2014 at 12:47 AM, Michael Barnes >>>>> <mjbarnes@cisco.com> wrote: >>>>>> Hi Manav, >>>>>> >>>>>> Perhaps I missed some earlier discussion, on why you >>>>>> decided to add the S-BFD Discriminator TLV to the RI LSA, >>>>>> but I would prefer it not be in that LSA. I would like to >>>>>> leave the RI LSA with only information pertinent to OSPF >>>>>> rather than pollute it with information for which OSPF has >>>>>> no interest. If you're concerned with a trend of creating a >>>>>> new Opaque type for every application which might want OSPF >>>>>> to carry information for it, then I would suggest we create >>>>>> a generic Application Information LSA. >>>>>> >>>>>> Regards, Michael >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On 05/30/2014 01:47 AM, Manav Bhatia wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We had submitted the following draft a couple of weeks >>>>>>> ago. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-bhatia-ospf-sbfd-discriminator-00.txt >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> This draft introduces a new OSPF RI TLV that allows OSPF routers to >>>>>>> flood the S-BFD discriminator values in the routing >>>>>>> domain. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> S-BFD is a new charter item (will be approved very soon) >>>>>>> in the BFD WG. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Would appreciate comments on this. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Cheers, Manav >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ OSPF >>>>>>> mailing list OSPF@ietf.org >>>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ospf >>>>>>> >>>>> . >>>>> >>> _______________________________________________ OSPF mailing >>> list OSPF@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ospf >> >> _______________________________________________ OSPF mailing list >> OSPF@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ospf > > . >
- [OSPF] Advertising S-BFD discriminators in OSPF Manav Bhatia
- Re: [OSPF] Advertising S-BFD discriminators in OS… Michael Barnes
- Re: [OSPF] Advertising S-BFD discriminators in OS… Manav Bhatia
- Re: [OSPF] Advertising S-BFD discriminators in OS… Michael Barnes
- Re: [OSPF] Advertising S-BFD discriminators in OS… Manav Bhatia
- Re: [OSPF] Advertising S-BFD discriminators in OS… Karsten Thomann
- Re: [OSPF] Advertising S-BFD discriminators in OS… Carlos Pignataro (cpignata)
- Re: [OSPF] Advertising S-BFD discriminators in OS… Acee Lindem
- Re: [OSPF] Advertising S-BFD discriminators in OS… Michael Barnes