Re: [PWE3] Posting of IPR Disclosure related to Cisco's Statement of IPR relating to draft-ietf-pwe3-oam-msg-map-12

This was more a discussion of scope than validity.

Of course, having public discourse in a community of experts that 
disparrages the validity of a claim could bolster invalidation arguments. 
So I can see how this might be a disavored act in the IEEE community, which 
seems to be slanted towards rights holders (I speak as a long-term member 
of IEEE and as a consultant on IPR). Perhaps we'd all be better off if the 
IEEE were a little more critical of misguided claims? Regular raising of a 
hue and cry of "Bullshit!" would go a long way towards reducing the damage 
caused by unmerited patents.

--
Dean Willis

------- Original message -------
> From: Trowbridge, Stephen J (Steve) <steve.trowbridge@alcatel-lucent.com>
> Cc: ietf-ipr@ietf.org, pwe3@ietf.org, adrian.farrel@huawei.com, 
> IETF@core3.amsl.com, andrew.g.malis@verizon.com, stbryant@cisco.com
> Sent: 14.4.'10,  8:47
>
> Hi all,
> In IEEE we are admonished to never discuss the essentiality or validity 
> of patent claims. I cannot believe this is considered an appropriate 
> discussion in IETF.
> Regards,
> Steve
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: pwe3-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:pwe3-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of 
> Yaakov Stein
> Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 2010 1:44 AM
> To: mmorrow@cisco.com; lmartini@cisco.com; tom.nadeau@bt.com; Aissaoui, 
> Mustapha (Mustapha); david.i.allan@ericsson.com; Busschbach, Peter B 
> (Peter)
> Cc: IETF@core3.amsl.com; Secretariat; pwe3@ietf.org; 
> adrian.farrel@huawei.com; andrew.g.malis@verizon.com; stbryant@cisco.com
> Subject: Re: [PWE3] Posting of IPR Disclosure related to Cisco's 
> Statement of IPR relating to draft-ietf-pwe3-oam-msg-map-12
>
>
> This disclosure (1311) quotes application US20080089227A1: Protecting 
> multi-segment pseudowires which may impact draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy, and 
> perhaps ICCP, MS-PW architecture, and MS-PW setup.
> There is no apparent connection with oam-msg-map - in fact the claims 
> stress that the triggers are failures of PSN elements (e.g. S-PEs) and are 
> NOT from the ACs, making any connection untenable.
>
> A previous disclosure by the same company (863) refers to
>     20080285466 : Interworking between MPLS/IP and Ethernet OAM 
> mechanisms which may impact mpls-eth-oam-iwk, but not oam-msg-map, unless 
> one interprets the first claim and its dependents much more broadly than 
> supported by the background and description.
>
> Can someone from the company claiming this IPR fix the information in 
> these disclosures ?
> At very least that company is required to disclose IPR is holds with 
> respect to the appropriate drafts (unless it is willing to risk forfeiting 
> its rights with respect to these ...).
>
> However, with respect to oam-msg-map I would like to request that it 
> consider removing inappropriate disclosures.
> Of course, if after consideration it believes that these disclosures ARE 
> appropriate, I would love to hear the reasoning.
>
> Y(J)S
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: IETF Secretariat [mailto:ietf-ipr@ietf.org]
> Sent: Tuesday, April 13, 2010 18:46
> To: mmorrow@cisco.com; Yaakov Stein; lmartini@cisco.com; 
> tom.nadeau@bt.com; Mustapha.aissaoui@Alcatel-lucent.com; 
> david.i.allan@ericsson.com; busschbach@alcatel-lucent.com
> Cc: stbryant@cisco.com; adrian.farrel@huawei.com; pwe3@ietf.org; 
> andrew.g.malis@verizon.com; matthew.bocci@alcatel-lucent.com; 
> ipr-announce@ietf.org
> Subject: Posting of IPR Disclosure related to Cisco's Statement of IPR 
> relating to draft-ietf-pwe3-oam-msg-map-12
>
> Dear Monique Morrow, Yaakov Stein, Luca Martini, Thomas Nadeau, Mustapha 
> Aissaoui, David Allan, Peter Busschbach:
>
> An IPR disclosure that pertains to your Internet-Draft entitled 
> "Pseudowire (PW) OAM Message Mapping" (draft-ietf-pwe3-oam-msg-map) was 
> submitted to the IETF Secretariat on 2010-04-07 and has been posted on the 
> "IETF Page of Intellectual Property Rights Disclosures" 
> (https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/1311/). The title of the IPR disclosure 
> is "Cisco's Statement of IPR relating to draft-ietf-pwe3-oam-msg-map-12."
>
> The IETF Secretariat
>
>
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