Re: [Rfced-future] Comments on draft-iab-rfcefdp-rfced-model-12

Peter Saint-Andre <stpeter@stpeter.im> Thu, 10 March 2022 22:09 UTC

Return-Path: <stpeter@stpeter.im>
X-Original-To: rfced-future@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: rfced-future@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 658D83A1C8A; Thu, 10 Mar 2022 14:09:49 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.109
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.109 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H5=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=stpeter.im header.b=lyCra5R7; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com header.b=h1JSae62
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kB2pzlppPdIb; Thu, 10 Mar 2022 14:09:44 -0800 (PST)
Received: from wout4-smtp.messagingengine.com (wout4-smtp.messagingengine.com [64.147.123.20]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AE2C63A1C8E; Thu, 10 Mar 2022 14:09:44 -0800 (PST)
Received: from compute3.internal (compute3.nyi.internal [10.202.2.43]) by mailout.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD8013200D78; Thu, 10 Mar 2022 17:09:43 -0500 (EST)
Received: from mailfrontend2 ([10.202.2.163]) by compute3.internal (MEProxy); Thu, 10 Mar 2022 17:09:44 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=stpeter.im; h=cc :cc:content-transfer-encoding:content-type:date:date:from:from :in-reply-to:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references :reply-to:sender:subject:subject:to:to; s=fm2; bh=xN6YZTleHSRPWj Zl5Ov4Tq+NR2UuAc9Y0Hs/Abg6S1M=; b=lyCra5R7ocvrAwhiJvPdyQaG8nMzKV DxHu+Ep2bSm5y0v4SOOCgl0AIUJ4c8u87zSvWqm1HQb3FiR5DPupp6LHbsmHkEqt PyjzjEuqpL/H8NaLW2WQCwH7CWrEHOR+gCLsBrlq/IVBH9u2ghOnP+XknC9U28ZW m6FwS6TzhE5wW+iIvxz670sXaDP20EoJBwv/FjiM1/aZJjjeUxVhcLoVdtvgfja3 VccuLneF7pa+3BEJAhw4MKTcRG/4RgX1fTFZhecXG9/Awr0mkloQ0Ja8TqPLkobx 07rOEKAEETC3XVnAilINHnaoJ4etXH6LyIZoljksyfaNAezsP7l4jkJQ==
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:cc:content-transfer-encoding :content-type:date:date:from:from:in-reply-to:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:reply-to:sender:subject :subject:to:to:x-me-proxy:x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender :x-sasl-enc; s=fm2; bh=xN6YZTleHSRPWjZl5Ov4Tq+NR2UuAc9Y0Hs/Abg6S 1M=; b=h1JSae62Z7IHHp7ofB9orj8BS9W6UTssFVvSIxUO37v7csq+1UMdWoyrx JysaqE3vjtKL8yOlMmvP0phlo5CcMmiLfxJPlC0h8QXZnXEcPIf2zLS/Kn7arAQa RHL+juF5IlDJAIDdhytL91JRdQFeayp8eMume4o5XrOFjPQ4QYtrZnn76Il9s6s5 qanvQXFxduHh3jzGHSdVLYmMTLXuv1BNc1OG4+b5E8v2GNHZI5X+rWgM2XuPQmJh prCbHr1rv70JmFTFlazTKsOzNrDp2u4Xh8jn3uvnJXwgHuux5Sm1sjJa3iKdBTGy 1GUtV7df+OPEOUjp5AeVamsM+/Fsg==
X-ME-Sender: <xms:JncqYgnZZMjZunipF4dN0zj0jrmMmcF3y4-NdWMktIK96NB7FNxPkw> <xme:JncqYv2aMBggdxfoGPUk33DYaWFz0v7WuyqK7mgcVni9z_WFCoZ0T1JJMDisrmF1R 4dP-FylT5nxt8ywrw>
X-ME-Received: <xmr:JncqYuqjjTbDiaR_x9NJh8vGTz5cRePtSbsSbNGUTnFiId8QUuCG0i2cb5Gu5WH9eAeiyEGAy3nXOaamOZPBqwkPeTkhfJ-5I7UrTK0>
X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvvddruddvtddgudehlecutefuodetggdotefrod ftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfgh necuuegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecusecvtfgvtghiphhivghnthhsucdlqddutddtmd enucfjughrpefkffggfgfvfhfhufgjtgfgsehtkeertddtfeejnecuhfhrohhmpefrvght vghrucfurghinhhtqdetnhgurhgvuceoshhtphgvthgvrhesshhtphgvthgvrhdrihhmqe enucggtffrrghtthgvrhhnpefgueegfedvkeetfeegkeekgefggfeuteetheegvdfgffev geekgfelhedtgeetfeenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrih hlfhhrohhmpehsthhpvghtvghrsehsthhpvghtvghrrdhimh
X-ME-Proxy: <xmx:J3cqYslyLsiabl90lOvq_eUYLwRp9eXWPpFZ-GQspR-LCrTcQmh07A> <xmx:J3cqYu05d1LtvKThf-2QAUACEoWhGYYjUjKMYeaTNL7rXMBo5sXXmA> <xmx:J3cqYjs0MagRkFNWdWlsF8qxcxz-wGJtQyG-0zs15-DMzI8Y1HYf7g> <xmx:J3cqYhTvfGnalPE2KgR_rqVcN2wSq8rpXYWsssi0rWhkXgmlljXzaQ>
Received: by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA; Thu, 10 Mar 2022 17:09:42 -0500 (EST)
Message-ID: <97b387f0-20a1-d658-1286-d61d6bac34ce@stpeter.im>
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2022 15:09:37 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.6.1
Content-Language: en-US
To: Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu>
Cc: Eliot Lear <lear@lear.ch>, "rfced-future@iab.org" <rfced-future@iab.org>, IAB <iab@iab.org>, The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>
References: <20220310060016.GV22457@mit.edu> <1e5d1934-806d-2689-4483-c3296e334e69@lear.ch> <20220310071251.GZ22457@mit.edu> <18a9ed03-1be6-5993-750a-5dccf7f21bdb@lear.ch> <0eaf0a63-91c2-9480-b361-e5d1554aaf3e@stpeter.im> <20220310214041.GD22457@mit.edu>
From: Peter Saint-Andre <stpeter@stpeter.im>
In-Reply-To: <20220310214041.GD22457@mit.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"; format="flowed"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/rfced-future/5nmEGylBpvqhkKCton42QGNoXaM>
Subject: Re: [Rfced-future] Comments on draft-iab-rfcefdp-rfced-model-12
X-BeenThere: rfced-future@iab.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: RFC Editor Future Development Program <rfced-future.iab.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.iab.org/mailman/options/rfced-future>, <mailto:rfced-future-request@iab.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/rfced-future/>
List-Post: <mailto:rfced-future@iab.org>
List-Help: <mailto:rfced-future-request@iab.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.iab.org/mailman/listinfo/rfced-future>, <mailto:rfced-future-request@iab.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2022 22:09:50 -0000

On 3/10/22 2:40 PM, Benjamin Kaduk wrote:

> On Thu, Mar 10, 2022 at 02:35:58PM -0700, Peter Saint-Andre wrote:
>>
>> On 3/10/22 1:28 AM, Eliot Lear wrote:
>>>
>>> On 10.03.22 08:12, Benjamin Kaduk wrote
>>>> It's getting late here, so maybe I'm just missing things, but while this
>>>> does seem to be an improvement, it still seems to have somewhat of a
>>>> mismatch with §4.3's depiction.  If I understand correctly, the RPC only
>>>> cares about value assignments insamuch as the values being assigned get
>>>> recorded in the RFCs being produced, and your new proposal doesn't
>>>> mention
>>>> documents/RFCs (other than this one) at all.
>>>
>>> "This document requires that the RPC document registry value
>>> assignments made by IANA."
>>
>> That's pretty much what it said before, no? ;-)
>>
>> I suggest this in the "RPC Responsibilities" section:
>>
>> 14. Ensuring that RFCs accurately document registry value assignments
>>       made by IANA.
>>
>> For the avoidance of doubt, we could also say the same thing under the
>> IANA considerations.
> 
> That does remove the bits I was confused about, but to me it also seems to
> change the semantics somewhat.  Namely, now the RPC is just consuming
> things produced by IANA, which could be seen as removing the possibility to
> coordinate on which allocations are actually to be made, from what
> range(s), etc., that the previous text seems to have implied.  I think I
> have seen the RPC notice things in editing that would affect what IANA
> does, and thus am not confident that describing this as a unidirectional
> flow would be entirely accurate.  (Whether such coordination could occur
> between RPC and IANA in an informal manner so as to get the right thing to
> happen anyway, is another question.)

Ah, I see, you were originally concerned about the text in Section 11, 
not the text in Section 4.3.

I wonder if something like this would be more accurate in §11:

"The RPC is responsible for coordinating with IANA to ensure that RFCs
accurately document registration processes and assigned values for IANA 
registries."

Peter