Re: [Tsvwg] Re: Last Call: Robust ECN Signaling with Nonces to Experimental

Mark Allman wrote:
>  
> Folks-
> 
> I asked a couple of questions about why this document is slated for
> experimental earlier today.  After some useful discussion I was
> asked to state my opinion on this matter in public (for the record
> and for others to shoot at, I presume).
> 
>>The IESG has received a request from the Transport Area Working
>>Group Working Group to consider Robust ECN Signaling with Nonces
>><draft-ietf-tsvwg-tcp-nonce-04.txt> as an Experimental Protocol.
> 
> I think this document should go forward as a proposed standard
> rather than experimental.
 >
> I see the role of experimental as for things that we are just not
> sure about.  The recent byte-counting I-D is a good example.  From
> everything we know about it, consensus seems to be that it should be
> OK.  But, it seems to me that the change is non-trivial enough and
> the direction of the questions are in the behavior of TCP in shared
> networks and what sorts of effects the change will have on traffic
> patterns.  So, going through a period of experimental status seems
> fine and prudent to me.
> 
> But, it seems to me that the ECN nonce is pretty straightforward.  I
> have good confidence that it will not fail in ways that are unsafe
> to the global network.  Of course, there is always the possibility
> of unforeseen interactions, but my own opinion is that the nonce is
> ready for proposed standard (which is not a full standard and we can
> still tweak things later).

I would like to see a reasonable wide-area deployment and statements 
about backward compatibility first.

In the absence of deployment experience, 'proposed standard' ends up 
asking us to conduct an experiment and not call it thus.

Sure, it's a 'chicken and egg' problem, but the onus is on the 
developers to deploy this solution and gain some operational experience 
before going to proposed standard, IMO.

The only reason to go to draft standard is if things CURRENTLY break 
worse without this mod than with. Otherwise, the track should be via 
Experimental first.

Joe

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