Re: [tsvwg] Comment on draft-ietf-tsvwg-transport-encrypt-13

Ruediger.Geib@telekom.de Tue, 24 March 2020 08:06 UTC

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From: <Ruediger.Geib@telekom.de>
To: <David.Black@dell.com>
CC: <tsvwg@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [tsvwg] Comment on draft-ietf-tsvwg-transport-encrypt-13
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Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2020 08:06:31 +0000
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tsvwg/sTHGDeg_YxRE8ZdRHv-MilongTc>
Subject: Re: [tsvwg] Comment on draft-ietf-tsvwg-transport-encrypt-13
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David,

don’t know, where this is heading to. Two observations, shared earlier on this list:


  *   I’ve distributed a link to a publication where Google gives advice to operators how to optimize access policer configuration. This optimization requires transport layer performance information.
  *   One result of encryption that I’m aware of are measurement applications residing in dedicated and consumer terminals, reporting results back to central servers. Reporting transport performance is one aspect.

Regards,

Ruediger

Von: tsvwg <tsvwg-bounces@ietf.org> Im Auftrag von Black, David
Gesendet: Montag, 23. März 2020 23:20
An: Joseph Touch <touch@strayalpha.com>om>; Tom Herbert <tom@herbertland.com>
Cc: tsvwg <tsvwg@ietf.org>
Betreff: Re: [tsvwg] Comment on draft-ietf-tsvwg-transport-encrypt-13

[writing as draft shepherd]

Point taken – would it be reasonable to rework that paragraph to observe that there should be incentives for endpoints to expose transport information, e.g., otherwise implementers may simply not bother?

Thanks, --David

From: tsvwg <tsvwg-bounces@ietf.org<mailto:tsvwg-bounces@ietf.org>> On Behalf Of Joseph Touch
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2020 11:20 AM
To: Tom Herbert
Cc: tsvwg
Subject: Re: [tsvwg] Comment on draft-ietf-tsvwg-transport-encrypt-13


[EXTERNAL EMAIL]


On Mar 23, 2020, at 7:58 AM, Tom Herbert <tom@herbertland.com<mailto:tom@herbertland.com>> wrote:

Fundamentally, transport layer is end-to-end information. There is no
contract between end hosts and the network that hosts have to be
honest or correct in setting information in the transport layer-- the
only contract is between the endpoints.

+1

Another point worth mentioning:

- if endpoints can lie or mislead about transport info to get their way, they can, will, and IMO *SHOULD*.

That goes for using port 53 for nearly anything anyone wants to. Transport info isn’t there to make things nice for network operators - that’s what the network layer is for.

Oh, yeah, I know - network operators don’t want “heavy” stuff in *their* headers because it slows them down when they don’t want it. Too bad, IMO. If they want the info, they need to deal with the pain.

Joe