Re: Catalog of IPv4 literals
bmanning@vacation.karoshi.com Sun, 25 July 2010 21:13 UTC
Return-Path: <owner-v6ops@ops.ietf.org>
X-Original-To: ietfarch-v6ops-archive@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietfarch-v6ops-archive@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F0123A6897 for <ietfarch-v6ops-archive@core3.amsl.com>; Sun, 25 Jul 2010 14:13:28 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -102.367
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.367 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.232, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4gjzrFpT1VUB for <ietfarch-v6ops-archive@core3.amsl.com>; Sun, 25 Jul 2010 14:13:27 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from psg.com (psg.com [IPv6:2001:418:1::62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBECE3A67BD for <v6ops-archive@lists.ietf.org>; Sun, 25 Jul 2010 14:13:26 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.72 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from <owner-v6ops@ops.ietf.org>) id 1Od8Tz-000IHD-Ec for v6ops-data0@psg.com; Sun, 25 Jul 2010 21:11:39 +0000
Received: from [2001:478:6:0:230:48ff:fe11:220a] (helo=vacation.karoshi.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.72 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from <bmanning@karoshi.com>) id 1Od8Tw-000I8w-7y for v6ops@ops.ietf.org; Sun, 25 Jul 2010 21:11:36 +0000
Received: from karoshi.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by vacation.karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id o6PLA8Sc020831; Sun, 25 Jul 2010 21:10:08 GMT
Received: (from bmanning@localhost) by karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id o6PLA8DE020830; Sun, 25 Jul 2010 21:10:08 GMT
Date: Sun, 25 Jul 2010 21:10:08 +0000
From: bmanning@vacation.karoshi.com
To: Cameron Byrne <cb.list6@gmail.com>
Cc: bmanning@vacation.karoshi.com, v6ops@ops.ietf.org
Subject: Re: Catalog of IPv4 literals
Message-ID: <20100725211008.GI19483@vacation.karoshi.com.>
References: <AANLkTi=fpJ9LvS=do+JFZOmgpomZUwQmCLOq0MPpwwDL@mail.gmail.com> <20100725200845.GA19483@vacation.karoshi.com.> <AANLkTiknKyXUbfsOLVOEpzH+UAUTdJ8KwvHeJahpGBpi@mail.gmail.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Disposition: inline
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTiknKyXUbfsOLVOEpzH+UAUTdJ8KwvHeJahpGBpi@mail.gmail.com>
User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i
Sender: owner-v6ops@ops.ietf.org
Precedence: bulk
List-ID: <v6ops.ops.ietf.org>
On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 02:02:59PM -0700, Cameron Byrne wrote: > On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 1:08 PM, <bmanning@vacation.karoshi.com> wrote: > > > > if an application "breaks" becuase someone uses an address literal instead > > of a domain name, then that application is itself broken. the DNS translates > > the name into an address and the address is used... so whether a name or > > a literal is handed to the app should be immaterial. > > > > Please think of the scope as limited to > draft-ietf-behave-v6v4-framework scenario #1, IPv6 network to an IPv4 > internet. If an IPv4 literal is passed at the application layer > (HTML, XML, ...) to a host with only IPv6 connectivity, the service is > broken to an IPv6-only user as where it works for an IPv4-only user. > Pedantry aside, this is the customer experience for some common > internet services. DNS names solve this problem since they allow > DNS64 to function. ok... then its a self-inflicted wound. IPv6 mapped addresses worked just fine until this wg depricated them. wrt DNS64, the translate functions I've been using for several years now doesn't require such hacks. > This draft draft-wing-behave-http-ip-address-literals attempts to > work around the problem of IPv4 literals passed to hosts in IPv6-only > networks, but the work around is only relevant for HTTP and will not > work for smartphones or dumbphones that don't have this proxy logic. yes, this turns out to be (as previously noted) an APPLICATION level problem. and i really question the wisdom of spending too much time on this corner/transition case. > > so your "catalog" of address literals is really the full set of all IP addresses. > > > > No. if you place all of the above restrictions on your premise, then I agree with you. --bill > > Cameron > > > --bill > > > > > > On Sun, Jul 25, 2010 at 09:01:12AM -0700, Cameron Byrne wrote: > >> Folks, > >> > >> It has been suggest several times to me that IPv4 literals be > >> cataloged in a central location so that those working to develop > >> IPv6-only networks and services can know the impact of IPv4 addresses > >> that are hard-coded into content and protocols. So, i created this > >> Google Groups http://groups.google.com/group/ipv4literals and provided > >> an example template for reporting found IPv4 literals. Right now, the > >> threat of IPv4 literals on IPv6-only networks is small from the > >> network operator perspective, it is not a blocking issue. But, for > >> the content owners who knowingly or unknowingly have IPv4 literals as > >> part of their service, this is major breakage. That said, they have a > >> right to know how their service will break so that they can accept the > >> risk of having their content unavailable on major networks or work to > >> use DNS names that will function correctly. Extra bonus points if > >> they resolve this issue of inter-operating with IPv6-only networks by > >> producing native IPv6 content! > >> > >> In my own efforts, i have found content owners very happy to receive > >> this proactive notification. Explicitly, myspace and Yahoo! have been > >> very good partners in finding and resolving issues of this nature and > >> removing IPv4 literals from their production services. Also, over the > >> course of my work I have seen Hulu.com independently move to using DNS > >> names. The issue is most commonly found with streaming services on > >> the Internet, especially ones involving CDNs. > >> > >> > >> Best regards, > >> > >> Cameron > >
- Catalog of IPv4 literals Cameron Byrne
- Re: Catalog of IPv4 literals bmanning
- Re: Catalog of IPv4 literals Cameron Byrne
- Re: Catalog of IPv4 literals bmanning