Re: [v6ops] I-D Action: draft-gont-v6ops-ipv6-addressing-considerations-00.txt

Eduard Metz <etmetz@gmail.com> Thu, 07 January 2021 08:48 UTC

Return-Path: <etmetz@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A10133A0AA1; Thu, 7 Jan 2021 00:48:19 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.096
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.096 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mqGUSUOFS5UK; Thu, 7 Jan 2021 00:48:17 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mail-lf1-x12c.google.com (mail-lf1-x12c.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::12c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 676A43A0A9E; Thu, 7 Jan 2021 00:48:17 -0800 (PST)
Received: by mail-lf1-x12c.google.com with SMTP id o10so1903679lfl.13; Thu, 07 Jan 2021 00:48:17 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=PLXpCWK1eq/moBDsDu0Qsx45djkmTIfS5geWEdEA78I=; b=MtO++4ESOW2JQtf3Rl3D2r8ttXTDn5TaGWZ0/qqhKqI0g1V0BtRAb2v28gtzVz/Kbv ii/oF6MiTZMemaU4cSQY/uxSMIHPoQX37LTVkKKhpawNPDgc1c5EaNGyuCaKSDkCLXRk A8KQ5KmnJ+hKlzDCQ7BstIjyDSfNNAGVUgpBNa7T1VCSE1JRL321pMr/IGIaUYnTJ5p4 y+Q5nRKA/foFT1d7hnGlywbzAl/hVycEM/CV/VO/ngEY2wbTrjAe9c6hqwBf8Tk4OiqE QK7+J2kX6bFG5ZmbB8dsVaXoyqI3tLEe/2gwM13OyufW5Bt3syQ32HrPZLQmw2dSUztu 0bdQ==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=PLXpCWK1eq/moBDsDu0Qsx45djkmTIfS5geWEdEA78I=; b=QP/OYLfBZWSRYswM+Y3BeTvQyxTBm6MpPsj/n4SVRrgkMK3fhWp/nbrze7Wj+rbDAs tDD9yhx0ynCe55bG0QxlNjAAqw1HeDdn4Qf4lISxMSSKbrZLavhYK2XEvihZVpaV0caz Mug6aMt2kHAblcfxdzjA3vllguuBI8+U8DIQSSQ+XolIsn3N49GMNNyncclONKR0pzPS vhJaB7GuUR6QjhDrHcVWcfBQgPC95htXEgg8q40oaqcAEpxd3YHoqcm7YK0nSrEz0cv1 XoB/NN5R9a1PvtUDwZ/5cyMK7GIe60V2TyXV85r8gs6B8pK9mH3ORx1G1oF4JK05kFea lKXQ==
X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533QiRh9Ix9DbkVO5dYZAGBJ5sC25I0v0I5a5zE4JbKTgVZLvvaB b/9+H25YKABWPGs2qJmhgErgVa0lnBzQohbiC1M=
X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzV9Bt0NdAZJtIv3CY6cz6clMbY4KPkX5Z1cwna4BBEht5DVBakJG1OtXTt1xu23IcD3BjP5WAV7x46mt0bPX4=
X-Received: by 2002:a05:651c:1341:: with SMTP id j1mr3990418ljb.216.1610009295263; Thu, 07 Jan 2021 00:48:15 -0800 (PST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <160770241261.18071.12524922630334294118@ietfa.amsl.com> <fb832698-039e-baa5-ed6f-4d5a97e7b354@gmail.com> <299f492f-4cb7-fa9d-967f-b2a5df49034e@si6networks.com> <759efdb1-a59c-788c-0c7a-5a8ca2ced904@gmail.com> <b20425a3-8069-3823-4610-79c93714ad2f@si6networks.com> <fa8c56d3-5d64-ae55-5be1-a3ec7d8f130d@gmail.com> <20201231103010.GL13005@Space.Net> <47fb8588-98ee-bf50-b377-921f75dc72e0@gmail.com> <CAG=3OHf5jSPgr-R8Ny=uHQi4exSEf7x-QVNDjePO59314NtoYg@mail.gmail.com> <20210105160815.GQ13005@Space.Net> <f7974fc1-28da-34c4-b8d6-b1d88d6ec73a@si6networks.com>
In-Reply-To: <f7974fc1-28da-34c4-b8d6-b1d88d6ec73a@si6networks.com>
From: Eduard Metz <etmetz@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2021 09:48:05 +0100
Message-ID: <CAG=3OHem5dNJoHNvMSZ4+Ct1=Vts8g8f5E2wD0rFG6mfqXQvcw@mail.gmail.com>
To: Fernando Gont <fgont@si6networks.com>
Cc: Gert Doering <gert@space.net>, Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>, IPv6 Operations <v6ops@ietf.org>, draft-gont-v6ops-ipv6-addressing-considerations@ietf.org
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000211a5e05b84b8094"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/v6ops/Xi19vczFYLWli22oYpEXhAR7lPA>
Subject: Re: [v6ops] I-D Action: draft-gont-v6ops-ipv6-addressing-considerations-00.txt
X-BeenThere: v6ops@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: v6ops discussion list <v6ops.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/v6ops/>
List-Post: <mailto:v6ops@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2021 08:48:20 -0000

It's indeed about the uniqueness of the prefix.
In terms of RFC4007 ULAs do not have a global scope, but are (or may be)
unique beyond link-local scope. There is not really a label for this it
seems

Apart from that ULA is hard to catch in terminology, I don't think there is
any disagreement

On Wed, Jan 6, 2021 at 3:10 AM Fernando Gont <fgont@si6networks.com> wrote:

> On 5/1/21 13:08, Gert Doering wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > On Tue, Jan 05, 2021 at 02:24:14PM +0100, Eduard Metz wrote:
> >> Maybe the last column should be "Applicable to Internet" (no / no / yes)
> >> or something along these lines. I assume the point here is to indicate
> that
> >> link-local and ULA cannot be used on the Internet.
> >
> > What is "the Internet"?
> >
> > We're an ISP, so if we use ULAs on our infrastructure, outside any
> > firewalls (but not announcing to other ASes, or leaking packets) - is
> > that "used on the Internet" or not?
>
> Agreed that "Applicable to Internet" is probably not a good taxonomy.
>
> The proper (and useful) taxonomy is that of "scope". ULAs clearly don't
> have a global scope (as per the definition in RFC4007).
>
> Given a ULA prefix (say, fd12:3456:7890:abcd::/64), it doesn't globally
> (and uniquely) identify a link. Similarly, nobody is in the position of
> publishing a ROA or restricting which AS can originate packets from such
> prefix.
>
> IMO, generating the "Global ID" of ULAs from a PRNG does reduce the
> possibility of collisions *when a limited number of ULA-based networks
> are interconnected* -- but the birthday paradox tells you can't expect
> the ULA prefixes to be globally unique. There's more to "global scope"
> than simply asserting that if you interconnect, say, two networks the
> chances of colliding prefixes will be small.
>
> Thanks,
> --
> Fernando Gont
> SI6 Networks
> e-mail: fgont@si6networks.com
> PGP Fingerprint: 6666 31C6 D484 63B2 8FB1 E3C4 AE25 0D55 1D4E 7492
>
>
>
>
>