Re: [alto] Call for Adoption: draft-bw-alto-cost-mode-01

Hi Med,

I went through the v01 and the update on https://tinyurl.com/alto-cost-mode-latest and would have a couple of  questions & suggestions, listed below, to be discussed.
Cheers,
Sabine

---------------
In draft-bw-alto-cost-mode-01
---------------

----- Section 3.1. Update to Section 6.1.2 of RFC7285
-– parag. 3, to better separate cost modes and values, how about the following change?
OLD
"NEW:
The cost mode ....  but additional values can be defined in the future."

NEW
"NEW:
The cost mode ....  but additional cost modes can be defined in the future."

--- Parag 4
“Cost modes are indicated in protocol messages as strings.”
As modes prefixed with "priv:" are allowed, maybe an encoding format is necessary. Something like:
  "The string MUST be no more than 32 characters, and it MUST NOT contain characters other than US- ASCII alphanumeric characters (U+0030-U+0039, U+0041 -U+005A, and U+0061-U+007A), the hyphen ('-', U+002D), the colon (':', U+003A), or the low line ('_', +005F)."

To simplify, the set of allowed characters may be more restrictive, as long as it contains (':', U+003A).

---------------
In https://tinyurl.com/alto-cost-mode-latest
---------------
----- Section 3.1 adds:
  "Future documents that define a new mode SHOULD indicate whether a new
                defined cost mode apply to all or a subset of cost types."

This sentence is hard to parse since the cost mode is one of the 2 components of a cost type, the other one being cost metric (RFC 7285 Section 6.1).
So do you mean: "applies to all or a subset of cost metrics?"

From: alto <alto-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of mohamed.boucadair@orange.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 8, 2022 10:16 AM
To: LUIS MIGUEL CONTRERAS MURILLO <luismiguel.contrerasmurillo@telefonica.com>; Dhruv Dhody <dhruv.ietf@gmail.com>
Cc: alto-chairs@ietf.org; Kai Gao <kaigao@scu.edu.cn>; alto <alto@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [alto] Call for Adoption: draft-bw-alto-cost-mode-01

Hi Luis,
Re-, Dhruv,

Thank you for sharing your thoughts. I wasn’t against “enabling private use”, but was not sure that having a dedicated prefix will stop from using other values that match local templates (e.g., prefix with a PEN) and which would achieve the same objective.

I hear the consistency argument made bye Dhruv. That’s what I went with the changes that you can track at: https://tinyurl.com/alto-cost-mode-latest

Cheers,
Med

De : LUIS MIGUEL CONTRERAS MURILLO <luismiguel.contrerasmurillo@telefonica.com<mailto:luismiguel.contrerasmurillo@telefonica.com>>
Envoyé : mardi 8 mars 2022 09:37
À : Dhruv Dhody <dhruv.ietf@gmail.com<mailto:dhruv.ietf@gmail.com>>; BOUCADAIR Mohamed INNOV/NET <mohamed.boucadair@orange.com<mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com>>
Cc : alto-chairs@ietf.org<mailto:alto-chairs@ietf.org>; Kai Gao <kaigao@scu.edu.cn<mailto:kaigao@scu.edu.cn>>; alto <alto@ietf.org<mailto:alto@ietf.org>>
Objet : RE: [alto] Call for Adoption: draft-bw-alto-cost-mode-01

Hi all,

I agree with Dhruv on the fact that enabling private use could be useful. I’m thinking on the fact of positioning ALTO as IETF Network Exposure Function (as described in draft-contreras-alto-ietf-nef-00) where some private (non-standard or experimental) information could be exposed among parties for specific purposes.

Best regards

Luis

De: alto <alto-bounces@ietf.org<mailto:alto-bounces@ietf.org>> En nombre de Dhruv Dhody
Enviado el: martes, 8 de marzo de 2022 8:09
Para: mohamed.boucadair@orange.com<mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com>
CC: alto-chairs@ietf.org<mailto:alto-chairs@ietf.org>; Kai Gao <kaigao@scu.edu.cn<mailto:kaigao@scu.edu.cn>>; alto <alto@ietf.org<mailto:alto@ietf.org>>
Asunto: Re: [alto] Call for Adoption: draft-bw-alto-cost-mode-01

Hi Med,

On Tue, Mar 8, 2022 at 11:53 AM <mohamed.boucadair@orange.com<mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com>> wrote:
Hi Dhruv,

Thank you for the comments.

We will be adding a “description” in the next iteration, however the details about the structure/etc should not be echoed in the table but be available in the pointer provided under “Specification”.

Dhruv: Maybe I was not clear. I meant to say the IANA sections in RFC 7285 included a lot more text than what is there in this I-D. See https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc7285#section-14.2 and https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc7285#section-14.3. I was suggesting using a similar format and adding more text about this new registry as well.

I’m not sure a specific prefix for private use is needed, but I may be mistaken. When running experiments, the owners can just pick any value which does not conflict with a value in the registry + provide the semantic/behavior to ALTO nodes that are involved in the experiment.

Dhruv: Experiments sometimes leak into the wild and thus we discourage simply picking any value and opting for private use and experimental use values in the IANA registry. Further, consistency in the protocol extensions is a good thing to have, and thus using priv: makes sense to me! I was not in the room when RFC 7285 was being developed. Maybe some of the OG participants from the WG could through some light on this as well :)

Thanks!
Dhruv

Cheers,
Med

De : Dhruv Dhody <dhruv.ietf@gmail.com<mailto:dhruv.ietf@gmail.com>>
Envoyé : mardi 8 mars 2022 06:52
À : Kai Gao <kaigao@scu.edu.cn<mailto:kaigao@scu.edu.cn>>
Cc : alto <alto@ietf.org<mailto:alto@ietf.org>>; alto-chairs@ietf.org<mailto:alto-chairs@ietf.org>
Objet : Re: [alto] Call for Adoption: draft-bw-alto-cost-mode-01

Hi Kai,

Support adoption!

Should the IANA consideration section follow the format followed by RFC 7285 which includes lot more details on the rationale, requested information, string format etc.

That also made me wonder if there is some benefit to also mark priv: for private use as done for some of the other ALTO registries.

Thanks!
Dhruv

On Mon, Mar 7, 2022 at 4:58 PM <kaigao@scu.edu.cn<mailto:kaigao@scu.edu.cn>> wrote:
Dear all,

I have been appointed to run the Call for Adoption of draft-bw-alto-cost-mode-01.

Following up with what has been proposed and agreed during the IESG review on draft-ietf-alto-path-vector [1], we are starting a call for adoption of the ALTO cost mode [2] document as a charter deliverable. It both helps push forward existing WG document and fits in the protocol maintenance item in the current charter.

The Call for Adoption will close on March 21 (2 weeks after the IETF submission deadline). Please post to the mailing list if you support or appose the adoption, or have any comments or suggestions.

[1] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/alto/WWoyJyM0PioBWM_rADYT-Z_I8t4/
[2] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-bw-alto-cost-mode-01

Thanks!

Best,
Kai
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