Re: [aqm] Alia Atlas' Yes on draft-ietf-aqm-codel-07: (with COMMENT)

Alia Atlas <akatlas@gmail.com> Thu, 13 April 2017 13:56 UTC

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From: Alia Atlas <akatlas@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2017 09:56:07 -0400
Message-ID: <CAG4d1rcLq=44ToOEA0jokdytjVJvqy3MmwUP5pz-CwVHVa1Lpw@mail.gmail.com>
To: "Mirja Kuehlewind (IETF)" <ietf@kuehlewind.net>
Cc: The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>, Wesley Eddy <wes@mti-systems.com>, AQM IETF list <aqm@ietf.org>, draft-ietf-aqm-codel@ietf.org, aqm-chairs@ietf.org
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Subject: Re: [aqm] Alia Atlas' Yes on draft-ietf-aqm-codel-07: (with COMMENT)
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Hi Mirja,

Thanks for the information.  I completely agree that it is up to the
authors, shepherd & WG Chairs as to what
clarity to add.

On the standards track not being required due to not needing
interoperability with at the same time not enough
deployment, I do think that having a clear statement would help encourage
that deployment.  Otherwise, it's a
catch-22.  I also don't know if codel or fq-codel is actually preferable
and the reasoning - but I haven't gone and
reread the latter.   For this work, where the deployment has real hardware
(ASIC, etc) consequences with long
lead-times, being clearer would help.

It's nice to see this work moving ahead.

Regards,
Alia

On Thu, Apr 13, 2017 at 6:34 AM, Mirja Kuehlewind (IETF) <
ietf@kuehlewind.net> wrote:

> Hi Alia,
>
> thanks for your feedback! Just on your first point regarding the status.
> The working group felt that there was not enough deployment to go directly
> to standards track and given AQM algorithm don’t need interoperability it
> was not really important for them to go to standards track right away.
> However, I leave it to the authors if they are able to add more text on how
> experimentation should be further performed.
>
> Mirja
>
>
>
> > Am 13.04.2017 um 07:28 schrieb Alia Atlas <akatlas@gmail.com>om>:
> >
> > Alia Atlas has entered the following ballot position for
> > draft-ietf-aqm-codel-07: Yes
> >
> > When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
> > email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
> > introductory paragraph, however.)
> >
> >
> > Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.
> html
> > for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
> >
> >
> > The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
> > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-aqm-codel/
> >
> >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > COMMENT:
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Thank you for a clear and very well written document.  This was well
> > worth staying up
> > past 1am to read fully.  I do have one primary comment and a couple minor
> > points.
> >
> > First, the document status is Experimental.   While encouraging
> > experimentation, the
> > document doesn't really articulate what the concerns are or how
> > experimentation might
> > determine that this should be changed to standards track.  While
> > regrettably I haven't
> > personally followed the AQM work, I might assume that some of the issues
> > to general
> > applicability might be tied to aspects around the challenges of applying
> > CoDel to a
> > system architecture built around WRED AQM and enqueue complexity rather
> > than dequeue
> > complexity.  Having a paragraph that gave context in the introduction for
> > the questions
> > still to be explored would be helpful.
> >
> > a) In Sec 3.4 :  "This property of CoDel has been exploited in
> >   fq_codel [FQ-CODEL-ID], which hashes on the packet header fields to
> >   determine a specific bin, or sub-queue, for each five-tuple flow,"
> >  For the general case of traffic, it would be better to focus on using a
> > microflow's
> >  entropy information  - whether that is derived from a 5-tuple, the IPv6
> > flow label,
> >  an MPLS Entropy label, etc.  Tying this specifically to the 5-tuple is
> > not ideal.
> >  Obviously I missed this for draft-ietf-aqm-fq-codel-06 - but even a
> > slight rephrasing
> > to "for each microflow, identifiable via five-tuple hash, src/dest + IPv6
> > flow label, or
> > other entropy information" would encourage better understanding of
> > micro-flow identification.
> > Of course, this is just a comment - so do with it what you will.
> >
> > b) (Nit) In Sec 5.1: " We use this insight in the pseudo-code for CoDel
> > later in the draft."
> >  The pseudo-code is actually earlier in the draft.  Also
> > s/draft/document for publication.
> >
> >
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>
>