Re: [Bier] Deborah Brungard's Block on charter-ietf-bier-01-06: (with BLOCK)

Hi folks,

I still have two minor questions (for re-charter rev 01-10):

1.       pce on extensions to program BIER forwarding on the BFIRs
Q: BFIRs or BFRs ? IMO, BIER forwarding exist in every BFR, while BIER overlay exist in BFIR.  I would like @Andrew to clarify.

2.       teas on architecture and control-plane mechanisms to use BIER-TE forwarding mechanisms.
Q: IMO, control-plane rarely use a forwarding mechanisms, but support to build a forwarding table for data-plane.
     So how about this: teas on architecture and control-plane mechanisms to build/support BIER-TE forwarding mechanisms.

Thanks,
XieJingrong

From: BIER [mailto:bier-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Alia Atlas
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 8:39 AM
To: BRUNGARD, DEBORAH A <db3546@att.com>
Cc: BIER WG <bier@ietf.org>; Toerless Eckert <tte@cs.fau.de>; The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>; bier-chairs@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Bier] Deborah Brungard's Block on charter-ietf-bier-01-06: (with BLOCK)

Hi Deborah,

Sure - that may end up making Toerless split his draft, but if TEAS is interested
and willing, that's fine.

I don't know if it's so much traffic-engineering as centralized/controller-based, but
that falls closer to TEAS or PCE anyway.

I'll update the charter and send you a ping.

Thanks,
Alia

On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 7:20 PM, BRUNGARD, DEBORAH A <db3546@att.com<mailto:db3546@att.com>> wrote:
Hi Alia,

This looks good- just slight tweak:
 * teas on control-plane mechnisms to use BIER-TE forwarding mechanisms.
/s/
 * teas on architecture and control-plane mechanisms to use BIER-TE forwarding mechanisms.

Thanks-
Deborah

From: Alia Atlas [mailto:akatlas@gmail.com<mailto:akatlas@gmail.com>]
Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2018 2:54 PM
To: BRUNGARD, DEBORAH A <db3546@att.com<mailto:db3546@att.com>>; Toerless Eckert <tte@cs.fau.de<mailto:tte@cs.fau.de>>
Cc: The IESG <iesg@ietf.org<mailto:iesg@ietf.org>>; BIER WG <bier@ietf.org<mailto:bier@ietf.org>>; bier-chairs@ietf.org<mailto:bier-chairs@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Bier] Deborah Brungard's Block on charter-ietf-bier-01-06: (with BLOCK)

Hi Deborah,

How about instead of:

OLD
  8) BIER Traffic Engineering: Definition of an architecture, and
       specification of the associated technology, for a BIER-based
       mechanism to support traffic engineering."

NEW
  9) Forwarding Plane Mechanisms for BIER Traffic Engineering: definition of
      how the new BIER forwarding plane structures (e.g. BIFT) can be used to
      support engineered multicast trees.  No control-plane work will be done in BIER-WG.

and the WGs to coordinate with will have added:

 * teas on control-plane mechnisms to use BIER-TE forwarding mechanisms.

Regards,
Alia

On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 8:08 PM, Deborah Brungard <db3546@att.com<mailto:db3546@att.com>> wrote:
Deborah Brungard has entered the following ballot position for
charter-ietf-bier-01-06: Block

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----------------------------------------------------------------------
BLOCK:
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While a Discuss, this should be simple to address as I think it's a bit of a misnomer
which Alvaro has already noted.
About:
"8) BIER Traffic Engineering: Definition of an architecture, and
   specification of the associated technology, for a BIER-based
   mechanism to support traffic engineering."

Looking at the wg draft (which it seems this new charter item is based on),
the draft says:
"It does support traffic engineering by explicit hop-by-hop forwarding"
and "it is more similar to SR than RSVP-TE".

So it is not TE, it is explicit forwarding. As Alvaro noted, this should not
be identified in the charter as TE. I don't see any need for this new item to
be in the charter (as Alvaro noted).

This is a Discuss because if this is not a simple misnomer, then this work
clashes with TEAS. TEAS is chartered and responsible for "Traffic-engineering
architectures for generic applicability across packet and non-packet networks.
This includes both networks that include the use of PCE and those that do not."

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