Re: [DMM] Call for adoption of draft-clt-dmm-tn-aware-mobility-08 as a WG document - Objections

"Joel M. Halpern" <jmh@joelhalpern.com> Wed, 06 January 2021 00:10 UTC

Return-Path: <jmh@joelhalpern.com>
X-Original-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: dmm@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F31A3A0F61 for <dmm@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 5 Jan 2021 16:10:39 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.382
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.382 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.262, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=joelhalpern.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qYjrD7dfLh2h for <dmm@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 5 Jan 2021 16:10:24 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mailb2.tigertech.net (mailb2.tigertech.net [208.80.4.154]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D0DFF3A0F4A for <dmm@ietf.org>; Tue, 5 Jan 2021 16:10:24 -0800 (PST)
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailb2.tigertech.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D9VB85X2zz1pDHQ for <dmm@ietf.org>; Tue, 5 Jan 2021 16:10:24 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=joelhalpern.com; s=2.tigertech; t=1609891824; bh=bOuDivLLzRQnHPc8IPvqOGDahVgFQeOq54/4uy6KGwo=; h=Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To:From; b=Mx5n0yrAu8jaeEsNQ01Y6PeRw5A7HdOySnA8nBVBTZtlxFPLSX3ugmBgMh55o32WP P7mPvjNTrCnaJQ22XQKBEYmkbD6C4SJgnpv/nCRj0BDvHrF+S51UO8ageGtUxYGKkb BBh7GrliZM3UASNbCn2/rgpc2sz20lXUsCCLeY6k=
X-Quarantine-ID: <I3Lt5Cx53Rws>
X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at b2.tigertech.net
Received: from [192.168.128.43] (unknown [50.225.209.66]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mailb2.tigertech.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4D9VB82WjQz1pG0L for <dmm@ietf.org>; Tue, 5 Jan 2021 16:10:24 -0800 (PST)
To: dmm <dmm@ietf.org>
References: <SN6PR13MB2334AD398B1B438613DE845085D10@SN6PR13MB2334.namprd13.prod.outlook.com> <96ffc11c-a823-19ca-3039-7881f60dd9c6@joelhalpern.com> <BYAPR13MB4197FB85159A5B393B02CBE8D9D10@BYAPR13MB4197.namprd13.prod.outlook.com> <198e4e59-a9e8-6f46-e4f0-6558ae1f909e@joelhalpern.com> <HE1PR07MB3386BF1545AB37BE66E909C99BD10@HE1PR07MB3386.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com> <CAF18ct7zJJ3MWqth_U+-UvxLzoe0R_vNQQbNKWdF+SRuOH1cZA@mail.gmail.com>
From: "Joel M. Halpern" <jmh@joelhalpern.com>
Message-ID: <fa56d084-6dbc-03d8-2da3-5bc53e4e9bc6@joelhalpern.com>
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 2021 19:10:22 -0500
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.6.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <CAF18ct7zJJ3MWqth_U+-UvxLzoe0R_vNQQbNKWdF+SRuOH1cZA@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format="flowed"
Content-Language: en-US
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/dmm/AvNYQHbR7aZnlzhjxYqAj2vdPM0>
Subject: Re: [DMM] Call for adoption of draft-clt-dmm-tn-aware-mobility-08 as a WG document - Objections
X-BeenThere: dmm@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: Distributed Mobility Management Working Group <dmm.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/dmm>, <mailto:dmm-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/dmm/>
List-Post: <mailto:dmm@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dmm-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmm>, <mailto:dmm-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 06 Jan 2021 00:10:40 -0000

Looking agin at the document, I have multiple problems with adoption of 
this document.

First, as just discussed, it seems to be laying out an archtiecture, but 
that architecture is not consistent with the other work going on in the 
IETF (specifically in the routing area, and known to many of the 
co-authors of this work.)

Second, the document states that it is Informational, and then is 
written as if it is defining the one and only way to structure the 
needed system.

Third, related to the second, this document seems to assert that there 
is a specific and correct way to use IETF technology to solve the 
problem.  Then, about three quarters of the way through it remembers 
that there are multiple alternatives for some parts.  The IETF rarely 
writes implementation specifications.  There are other SDOs that do so. 
  They can wrestle with the problem of defining something that can be 
utilized by multiple operators with varying constraints.  Why would we 
want to get into trying to have that fight?

For the WG chairs, I am trying to figure out how this even fits the DMM 
charter.  It is a LOT more than network exposure, which is the closest I 
can see in the charter.

Yours, unhappily,
Joel