Re: [Emailcore] Proposed ESMTP keyword RCPTLIMIT

Laura Atkins <laura@wordtothewise.com> Sat, 13 March 2021 14:55 UTC

Return-Path: <laura@wordtothewise.com>
X-Original-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14D0F3A10C0 for <emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sat, 13 Mar 2021 06:55:11 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.098
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=wordtothewise.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UpuMmlQNIF-Y for <emailcore@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sat, 13 Mar 2021 06:55:09 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mail.wordtothewise.com (mail.wordtothewise.com [104.225.223.158]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 599153A10BF for <emailcore@ietf.org>; Sat, 13 Mar 2021 06:55:09 -0800 (PST)
Received: from [192.168.0.227] (unknown [37.228.231.27]) by mail.wordtothewise.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id C87749F149 for <emailcore@ietf.org>; Sat, 13 Mar 2021 06:55:07 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=wordtothewise.com; s=aardvark; t=1615647308; bh=wq+xUPNH+jIdLkFcbVhiV5fNYhZfJQw7jiBjg9YGuF8=; h=From:Subject:Date:References:To:In-Reply-To:From; b=JQcqnHGiLz1Pr2ZScb/QW7Kda8K4FbUNP131kT+v5u/J2CKLMIuTLXQ5svwof+qGj aBeT/72jgNURVMvX593LQYSQAgufXe2pqHILka8a8jamQLaqM3UXo7h7hj39Fehhch ITN+DxVME0BqH/RfH6zUmKchBDmKLTCODCjSeYWA=
From: Laura Atkins <laura@wordtothewise.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_53E2239E-BE70-46FE-8BF2-F89775E82068"
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\))
Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2021 14:55:05 +0000
References: <20210312203224.F3739701E4C5@ary.qy>
To: emailcore@ietf.org
In-Reply-To: <20210312203224.F3739701E4C5@ary.qy>
Message-Id: <99914607-1DBE-4782-AE81-04FC77D29028@wordtothewise.com>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4)
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/emailcore/RcaYC6GG0aO8a6F1WXzzgz1GAY4>
Subject: Re: [Emailcore] Proposed ESMTP keyword RCPTLIMIT
X-BeenThere: emailcore@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: EMAILCORE proposed working group list <emailcore.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/emailcore>, <mailto:emailcore-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/emailcore/>
List-Post: <mailto:emailcore@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:emailcore-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/emailcore>, <mailto:emailcore-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2021 14:55:11 -0000


> On 12 Mar 2021, at 20:32, John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote:
> 
> It appears that Laura Atkins  <laura@wordtothewise.com> said:
>>> max line length\
>>> max number of lines
>>> max number of characters for total message
>>> MIME limits (eg., nesting depth)
>>> Unicode or other character limits
> 
> I don't think it is a good idea to provide standard ways to say that an
> implementation doesn't comply with a standard.  There's a line length limit
> in the spec, it's not hard to support.
> 
>> Is there a place for ‘max connections’ - a number of places already limit the number of maximum connections that
>> any sending system can make at one time. A way to mechanically advertise that might be useful. 
> 
> Intereesting question but then I ask max connections from what, a single IP, a /24,
> something else?  

That would be for the folks advertising to say what they’re using and what they’re limiting by. The limits are actively in place, it’s just do we want to describe them in a more formal way. 

> I also worry this could be close to saying here's how to DDoS me.

The limits I was thinking of are policy not technology. Alex brings up a good point that the limits are not set in stone but do change depending on the reputation of the sender / mailstream / IP address. 

> Also for this particular case I'd say the excess connection should greet
> with 421 and enhanced status code (it's be 4.3.7) to say too many connections.

Makes sense. 

laura 

-- 
Having an Email Crisis?  We can help! 800 823-9674 

Laura Atkins
Word to the Wise
laura@wordtothewise.com
(650) 437-0741		

Email Delivery Blog: https://wordtothewise.com/blog