IETF Logo Mail Archive

Re: Network Energy Management

Joel Halpern <jmh@joelhalpern.com> Fri, 05 August 2022 23:23 UTC

Return-Path: <jmh@joelhalpern.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AEC89C157B5E for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 5 Aug 2022 16:23:01 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.128
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.128 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, URIBL_DBL_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, URIBL_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=joelhalpern.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YwAjdPgQm-4A for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 5 Aug 2022 16:22:57 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mailb2.tigertech.net (mailb2.tigertech.net [208.80.4.154]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C60E5C157B5D for <IETF@ietf.org>; Fri, 5 Aug 2022 16:22:57 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailb2.tigertech.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4M01q54Dc7z1pM9R; Fri, 5 Aug 2022 16:22:57 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=joelhalpern.com; s=2.tigertech; t=1659741777; bh=vZnj14gq1Jx61UUlQiMVagIUbW2jW0CftBJC1zJJ4Tg=; h=Date:Subject:To:Cc:References:From:In-Reply-To:From; b=Dv8oG4vICbreZv24BkQYYNx4/Bkweecm8DFeDs7Ti3pScWfJSIn038kwgvuVxwsmq hUXDRskQelL7JYx9wyRBvmX4ZjNWEwtJY7wME0kt0LT8o0P37M9jfX9LBdwnZ36cbk bPekrAL0E5mFeMPoioe67Je860C+xln4xm+cxFlc=
X-Quarantine-ID: <CCasKbfj4jST>
X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at b2.tigertech.net
Received: from [192.168.23.181] (unknown [50.233.136.230]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by mailb2.tigertech.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4M01q45KkGz1pK3v; Fri, 5 Aug 2022 16:22:56 -0700 (PDT)
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------eWm9TfarGSSbE63fhY6GUOHF"
Message-ID: <8f308769-ad04-8f97-7a84-5f98ba27afee@joelhalpern.com>
Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2022 19:22:55 -0400
MIME-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.11.0
Subject: Re: Network Energy Management
Content-Language: en-US
To: Hesham ElBakoury <helbakoury@gmail.com>, Fred Baker <fredbaker.ietf@gmail.com>
Cc: IETF <IETF@ietf.org>
References: <8FBAF87A-2690-4543-9713-0F22D1423B8E@gmail.com> <A8687A4E-BA7A-4375-B7E2-C57ADD396842@gmail.com> <CAFvDQ9r-G8O8dzYBvrdzorVHyAE=Edbb7FZkCzrhTzLh98DyAQ@mail.gmail.com>
From: Joel Halpern <jmh@joelhalpern.com>
In-Reply-To: <CAFvDQ9r-G8O8dzYBvrdzorVHyAE=Edbb7FZkCzrhTzLh98DyAQ@mail.gmail.com>
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/5j-mRH0JGdTqemG2X-muHzXLOT4>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.39
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2022 23:23:01 -0000

I can't speak for Fred, but I don't think we as a community even know 
what "energy efficient protocol" means.  Much less how that trades off 
against all the other aspects of protocol design.

We do consider message size and frequency when we design protocols.  We 
consider those aspects along with lots of others. if that is "designing 
energy efficient protocols" then we already do so.  On the other hand, 
design for issues such as to to partially wake up a sleeping device is 
generally outside our remit and skill set.  And is meaningless for many 
of our devices.

Yours,

Joel

On 8/5/2022 7:18 PM, Hesham ElBakoury wrote:
> Hi Fred,
> Do you think  IETF engineers have the skill sets to design energy 
> efficient protocols or enhance existing ones to be more energy efficient ?
>
> Thanks,
> Hesham
>
> On Fri, Aug 5, 2022, 1:22 PM Fred Baker <fredbaker.ietf@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>     Echoing a previous post, I’m not sure sustainability is part of
>     our skill set. If we were to try to forcibly add it, I suspect
>     we’d get the same level of response security originally got:
>     “sustainability is not specified in this document”.
>
>     Sent using a machine that autocorrects in interesting ways...
>
>     > On Aug 5, 2022, at 2:26 AM, Stewart Bryant
>     <stewart.bryant@gmail.com> wrote:
>     >
>     > Perhaps it is time for a new mandatory section in RFCs:
>     sustainability?
>

v2.23.0 | Report a Bug | By Email