Re: [Int-area] ILA and int-area

Erik Kline <ek@google.com> Wed, 17 May 2017 03:28 UTC

Return-Path: <ek@google.com>
X-Original-To: int-area@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: int-area@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82DD61200C5 for <int-area@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 16 May 2017 20:28:37 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.001
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.001 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=google.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3bQTjICEc136 for <int-area@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 16 May 2017 20:28:35 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-yb0-x232.google.com (mail-yb0-x232.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4002:c09::232]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CCAB01270A3 for <int-area@ietf.org>; Tue, 16 May 2017 20:25:27 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-yb0-x232.google.com with SMTP id j17so76477ybj.0 for <int-area@ietf.org>; Tue, 16 May 2017 20:25:27 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=BU0phTt+zoYXSBY4dc2F15vqORBgL3jo9lql5WeyKdU=; b=u5gLYp1gEGte8VCuYRw1PavAuDtO2kaFN47VLw+TIyvHzjw0OlfRY7DFXzgCtyL+NF aUYs18kG3MgjZ/uh0LRmH98ZzIDMzsu4v569H5u1V224/ry9NcQQ5kd3RLaSHdC2Uid+ NnUB5FC1wqNU8ra+howZhR79pXL045r1ZqS0fqtLMAx7L9c6GBmy7C1TxVxEAf5/vGeu MS8i4nhfAi10xHMPAlvxaeP92ZteRBDC2QeF5Onq3dSjDeHAmE353afgGxodVw7SY8Dr A1QZQ/yoQ4Cy0Kc0iCQnGA1QEiX4p78k6l6z7EQ6ItKssYFdF2fKoPPGB1tIEwVpuhi3 5sCw==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=BU0phTt+zoYXSBY4dc2F15vqORBgL3jo9lql5WeyKdU=; b=DzriAHy3SKFO0Z7g3cm3bH501Bl+G5F8YWTcmA/4OTiAgAkNqS39PV6245a9WkVkYb doEKWwN9guwkRNnLriLLJre4a+n6CERmO0R27sK9Pm3egHt5WKb2vxnz+fwjplYvKq57 a90glBVLmf/w4Vb+pP6ZwEN7etVB0JwNDTvERgdHYuITEm0ygjZ0ENcK2RUTofrbcMt7 6BzbYqbp+PMbUvAafCErcltN5lDWhvE/8ouKmYrJceJtF5pZdNb9bV0kD/FQfsd+faVS lfDk1KalKC0Y6L9PocY8Rp/mSohNU14XYsgqPhqyzLrhz5tWJo5cmS7a1TNOvVTVAb8E 15wg==
X-Gm-Message-State: AODbwcA4sHHKrDMV7eOoZzLhR/eRrx4qf2w7lUNG+DRoMcrtPjzbSP5G zkwZJxqTOFBN6HGt2BxwOWKcK+Xo4WGy
X-Received: by 10.37.173.225 with SMTP id d33mr952510ybe.1.1494991526753; Tue, 16 May 2017 20:25:26 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Received: by 10.37.105.84 with HTTP; Tue, 16 May 2017 20:25:06 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <CALx6S35bMXCrVuH-8+oNCuq+Aw0Fw4cL-hGpVfX9E3QHaxGG7w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALx6S34A5k_DtEb7YWQs=Y79p4rCpe-9Hg3_YiqbOSyWzqepYA@mail.gmail.com> <813a6560-4513-958a-0898-d42133285a34@joelhalpern.com> <CALx6S35bMXCrVuH-8+oNCuq+Aw0Fw4cL-hGpVfX9E3QHaxGG7w@mail.gmail.com>
From: Erik Kline <ek@google.com>
Date: Wed, 17 May 2017 12:25:06 +0900
Message-ID: <CAAedzxox77q+u5XpjSX3_UwLfrNoUymdO0TvDZYYD2adb9NfiQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: Tom Herbert <tom@herbertland.com>
Cc: "Joel M. Halpern" <jmh@joelhalpern.com>, Petr Lapukhov <petr@fb.com>, "int-area@ietf.org" <int-area@ietf.org>
Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha-256; boundary="f403045eb87aeb7f4a054fafd602"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/int-area/25tVGRn0_MzTBy12cAWqcbyH0WY>
Subject: Re: [Int-area] ILA and int-area
X-BeenThere: int-area@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF Internet Area Mailing List <int-area.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/int-area>, <mailto:int-area-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/int-area/>
List-Post: <mailto:int-area@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:int-area-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/int-area>, <mailto:int-area-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 May 2017 03:28:37 -0000

On 14 May 2017 at 03:21, Tom Herbert <tom@herbertland.com> wrote:

> On Sat, May 13, 2017 at 11:03 AM, Joel M. Halpern <jmh@joelhalpern.com>
> wrote:
> > It appears to me that there are contexts in which it is likely that ILA
> is
> > useful.
> >
> > Using the example of the progression of LISP, I have concern with the
> > current approach of NOT spelling out how and where it would be used. LISP
> > started out as experimental in significant part because it was not clear
> > where it would be useful.  We re now progressing it to PS with a clear
> > context.  And that context is NOT Internet-wide deployment for Internet
> > scaling.  Because that deployment problem is REALLY challenging.
> >
> > As such, if ILA wants to either be developed for the data center context
> or
> > be developed as an interesting experiment across a range of potential
> uses,
> > I can not object.
> >
> > I do have problems moving it forward towards standards track for some
> > unspecified but general use in its current form.  The dependence of the
> data
> > plane protocol on the information distribution is so strong that I do not
> > see how the general case can be treated.
> >
> Hi Joel,
>
> Intended status is listed as informational if that helps.
>
> I tend to think that the relationship between an ILA data plane and
> control plane is analogous to the relationship between the IP protocol
> and routing protocols. Yes, there is a strong dependency on having a
> control plane, but mandating a specific control plane as part of the
> core protocol reduces flexibility and extensibility.


Put another way: the domain of applicability is the same as the domain(s)
over which the control plane operates.  Any ILA packets outside that/ose
domain/s should just look like vanilla IPv6.